Amway Archive
June 27, 2008
Orrin Woodward wants Amway to confront reality
Posted by Truth
Today I read an article over at Orrin Woodward's blog titled "Amway/Quixtar North America - Confronting Brutal Reality". In a nutshell Orrin goes through some numbers and other data to come to the conclusion that Amway/Quixtar has actually declined in sales since 1980. This of course is summed up to the leadership at Amway and the conclusion that they are not facing the reality of their broken business model.
At the end of the article Orrin gives Amway some "free advice" and has some comments that I found to be stinging:
"Judging by the sales of Amway North America, I believe that the Amway managers are receiving poor grades on their leadership competence. If Dick Devos believes he has the ability to run the state of Michigan as Governor, then I would recommend that he prove it on his beloved Amway business first. It would make Dick’s message more palatable to the Michigan voters. The Amway managers are welcome in advance for this free advice."
For me personally the icing on the cake for this article was the schooling job he did on one commenter by the name IBOFightback aka "Insider", or as Orrin called him "David Fightback". Insider didn't stick around too long.
UPDATE: Thanks to Imran I noticed that Orrin has blocked links from this site. Interesting to say the least, I have asked him what the deal was.
UPDATE: Orrin has responded below in a comment regarding his blog blocking links from this site. In a nutshell he doesn't know why, and is going to have it taken care of. Thanks Orrin.
May 28, 2008
Hey Amway IBO...you haven't done anything yet!
Posted by Truth
What is it about some IBOs that makes them think simply by being in Amway they are already more successful then any broke loser who is getting by working at their J-O-B? They know who they are, we have all seen them, read their comments, there is no denying it. They are usually the ones who get offended when asked how much profit they claimed on their taxes, as if it was matter of the utmost national security, and can't possibly understand where some slimy critic who couldn't hack it in their super successful business gets off asking such a question.
Well here is where we get off asking such a question. Chances are good those slimy critics are doing better financially in their J-O-B then you are, or for that matter ever will do in your business. Chances are good those slimy critics who are doing the right things with their money are going to be walking some beaches of the world, while the closest many IBOs will get to a beach is cleaning out the cat litter box on the weekends.
Now this might be sounding a bit harsh, and trust me I do not have any intentions of degrading or belittling anyone. It's like my old Drill Sergeant told us on the day we were to graduate from basic training.
"It's about humility soldiers, you gotta know you ain't no (stinkin) battle-hardened war hero, you are the lowest of the low and you gotta earn it here son."
Notice the parentheses as the word really used was much more colorful then the one I put in there, I will let you use your imagination. But the point being is that he was right, we all thought we were big and bad cause we got to fire some weapons, learned some hand-to-hand combat, completed some of the most physically challenging things we had ever faced, and now we thought we were a bunch of green fightin machines. When in reality we were nothing more then a bunch of kids who had a total of two months in the Army and didn't have the first clue as to real soldiering.
So to you IBOs, and you know who you are. Don't get offended next time you are asked for your financial information about your business. People just want to see if you are the battle-hardened war hero that you are acting like you are when you are flipping off at the mouth about J-O-Bs and telling others that they are going to be broke losers the rest of their life because they don't think Amway is the best thing that they have ever heard of. In a nutshell it's their way of saying "You gotta earn it here son!"
May 23, 2008
The Amway IBO Chicken Flock
Posted by Truth
I got my Believe DVD just the other day and thought the movie was great. It was funny, sadly true in so many ways and I thought it did a great job at taking a funny poke at some issues within the MLM industry including Amway. Interestingly enough the part I liked the most had nothing to do with the movie but rather one of the Special Features on the DVD. It was the interview with the "Industry Insider", not to be confused with our at times local Amway supporter who goes by the handle Insider or IBOFightBack.
Contrary to our local Amway supporter this Insider who was interviewed about this DVD was refreshingly honest about his industry. He was quite open in admitting that much of what is portrayed in the movie happens in the MLM industry, and unlike many IBOs who comment on this site (including Insider) he doesn’t try to make excuses by speculating on the numbers of actual abuses. Matter of fact he quite openly admits there are too many cases of abuse by uplines in the MLM industry.
My favorite part of the interview was when he was asked about what kind of reactions the movie would get. His answer was that they would get all kinds of reactions from all different kinds of individuals. When talking about those who would react with anger and offense he repeated a one-liner that his Grandma had told him many years ago: "If you throw a rock into a flock of chickens you know the one you hit because it comes out squawking." Basically stating that if you are angry about this movie it is most likely hitting a nerve about something you are doing in your business.
Not only do I feel like that is true with this movie, but it is also true with this blog. This blog in a metaphorical sense throws rocks into the Amway IBO Chicken flock at times, yet the reactions always seem to be different. Yes, we certainly get our share of IBOs that come out squawking, they like to tell us what a loser we are and how we just didn't have the backbone to make it to Diamond. They tell us to enjoy being broke, etc, etc, and on and on and on. On the other hand we also have those who come here and say "Wait a minute….I have never seen that, this is the way things are done in my organization." and usually go on to have a constructive conversation. Sadly the latter seems to comment here way less then the other type.
As far as I am concerned the squawkers just signal that what was written is true, one of my favorite lines has always been "The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off." For any of you who have the movie and have not watched the interview I would highly recommend it. Also, just to point out an interesting note about this movie, they didn't just take some playful pokes at IBOs, they also took some at "critics" which I found quite funny. The guy living in an underground basement doing a radio show (which I like to compare to the podcasts Qblog and I used to do) plotting his protests and just coming across as over the top obsessed with the destruction of the company Believe was some of the funniest scenes in the movie. However I don't see any "critics" squawking at this portrayal, I wonder why that is?
April 12, 2008
Perfect Water now not as Perfect.
Posted by Truth
Since I first found out about this new perfect water product that Amway is going to be distributing the thing that of course caught my attention was the claims that were being made about this product. The whole deal about having improved flexibility, balance, and strength in just seconds with one ounce I found to be quite outrageous. No surprise to me however was the comments from those who came here defending such ridiculous claims.
In this situation however this story actually has a different twist from the outrageous product claims that have been made about Amway products of the past. A quick trip over to amquix.info shows several articles that Scott Larsen has written about perfect water and in many of those articles he has screen shots of the perfect water website as it has evolved. The twist on this product is that the manufacturer was making the claims as well and even had the infamous "tip-test" instructions posted on their website.
At the start it appears from the screen shots that the perfect water manufacturer was indeed making claims about improving balance, strength, flexibility. Also, they had the tip-test instructions posted for anyone to read and try out to prove how perfect their water was indeed. Today however the perfect water site makes absolutely no claims about their water except to say it's a great bottle of water. Nothing about a tip-test, or an improvement in any capacity.
I actually feel sorry for the IBOs on this one since the manufacturer of the product appeared to be encouraging these claims at one time, even though I believe some common sense questioning of the tip-test would show it to be bunk. Now that the perfect water site has removed all claims about the balance, flexibility and strength improvements it is my opinion they never really believed that their water could improve any of that. Now that the claims have been removed from the website however I am interested to see how many IBOs continue to defend the tip-test and the claims that were previously made about this product.
March 27, 2008
Amway and their Perfect Water
Posted by Truth
Around the web I have been seeing more and more articles about the Perfect Water product from Amway. Of course it is open to some skepticism because of the claims that are being made, which are that you can have better balance, strength and flexibility after even just one ounce and this can occur within seconds. Apparently there are demonstrations of this being done by IBOs and many of those videos can be found on the web.
A search for Amway and Perfect Water on YouTube will show several videos from open meetings of these "demonstrations". I have watched several videos and I have a hard time believing some of the claims that they are making can happen with just one ounce of water, and occur in an instant on top of that. So I have included a couple of videos in this post, one of them is a demonstration and the other is a video uploaded by Scott Larsen showing how he believes the IBOs are rigging the tests. I will let you make up your own mind about the water.
UPDATE:
Over at the opportunity zone there is a post about making false claims about products, and references perfect water directly. The article is written by Gary VanderVen and he states in the article:
IBOs must only use claims and demonstrations which have been approved by Quixtar to promote this product. This list of approved claims is available at www.drinkperfectwater.com or in the "What's New" section at www.quixtar.com.
So with that I paid a visit to the drinkperfectwater.com site to see what kind of claims they make about the water, since they would be the approved claims for IBOs to use, here is what I found in the FAQ section:
What are the benefits of drinking Perfect Empowered Drinking Water? The water has been developed as a premium drinking water and is intended only for that use. No specific benefit claims are made nor represented. To see what others are saying, see the Testimonials tab on drinkperfectwater.com and share with us your own testimonials as to the ways you feel Perfect Empowered Drinking Water benefits you! (emphasis mine)
So since the site FAQ says they make no specific benefit claims or do the represent any are the demonstrations by IBOs in the videos seen on YouTube a violation? An argument could be made either way and I won't comment on that question myself but again I will leave it up to you to make up your own mind.
February 18, 2008
Wal-Mart and Amway / Quixtar
Posted by Truth
When I was in Quixtar I remember many times references to Wal-Mart being used. During an open meeting the speaker would tell the prospects that instead of spending their money at Wal-Mart they could buy from their own company and make money. IBOs tell people that Wal-Mart never gave them a check for shopping there like they get from their own business. Wal-Mart this and Wal-Mart that. Pretty much every time a reference to a traditional business was used it was Wal-Mart.
So when I saw an article by Ray Alexander in the Opportunity Zone titled "Not Wal-Mart and never want to be" I couldn't help but laugh a little. The question isn't that IBOs need to compete with the Wal-Marts, Sam's Clubs, etc. It's a matter of IBOs need to stop comparing themselves to them. You see an IBO can argue that the quality of their products are so much better then Wal-Mart till they are blue in the face. But each time you compare the Quixtar business to shopping at Wal-Mart you kill the argument.
I see Quixtar IBOs prospecting people in Wal-Mart all the time. So is it any wonder that they feel they have to compete against Wal-Mart? Not that there is anything wrong with shopping at Wal-Mart, but do you think people who are doing a good deal of shopping at Wal-Mart are more concerned about price or quality? The obvious answer to that question begs this question for IBOs, if your products are of such great quality what in the world are you doing going after a market that is interested in price? Something tells me when IBOs stop comparing themselves to Wal-Mart Ray won't have to tell everyone that Quixtar / Amway doesn't want to be Wal-Mart.
February 11, 2008
More on the Amway Arbitration case
Posted by Truth
As expected the reversal of the arbitration ruling in the Morrison case has made it's rounds and now the IBOAI, Alticor, and even others are putting their two cents in. Of course most of what is being said I don't think is even addressing the issues. To me it looks like more damage control then anything. At any rate there are apparently some things that the IBOAI want you to know.
1. The decision in this case could be changed in future court proceedings. (Much like how the earlier decision in favor of Amway was later changed in future court proceedings).
2. The Morrison decision was based upon arbitration agreement rules that were in effect in 1998 and have since changed. For instance Amway can no longer make changes to the agreement without the consent of the IBOAI.
3. The dispute arose before January 1, 1998 when the arbitration agreement went into effect and therefore that does not apply to anyone who had a dispute after 1998.
As far as Alticor goes they are trying to say that all Morrison gets is a redo of his arbitration, and that the decision was based off of the fact that the dispute arose prior to 1998. But from the way I read it the court is saying there was no enforceable arbitration agreement because of Amway's unilateral authority to amend.
Other certain Amway supporters have also written on their site that after having time to read the decision "properly" they also see the decision being based off of the fact that there was no arbitration in effect at the time of the dispute. Well apparently time was of no help to read the decision properly.
The way I read it however the final wording in the decision clearly is referring to Amway's unilateral right to amend the agreement. Here is what the final wording is in the decision:
There is nothing in any of the relevant documents which precludes amendment to the arbitration program – made under Amway’s unilateral authority to amend its Rules of Conduct – from eliminating the entire arbitration program or its applicability to certain claims or disputes so that once notice of such an amendment was published mandatory arbitration would no longer be available even as to disputes which had arisen and of which Amway had notice prior to the publication. There are no Halliburton type savings clauses which preclude application of such amendments to disputes which arose (or of which Amway had notice) before the amendment. We accordingly hold that the arbitration agreement was illusory and unenforceable under Davidson as applied to the claims asserted in the instant suit.12 We thus reverse the district court’s October 15, 1998 order staying the case pending arbitration and its September 15, 2005 final judgment denying the Distributors’ motion to vacate the award, granting Amway’s motion to confirm the award, and entering judgment based upon the award; and we remand the case for further proceedings not inconsistent herewith. (emphasis mine)
The reference to Halliburton is addressed earlier in the document where Halliburton's arbitration was ruled not illusory since they could not avoid arbitration by amending or terminating the arbitration provision due to the way it was written. Amway had no such "saving clause".
But as with anything I encourage you to go and read the decision yourself and come to your own conclusion. This case is quite old and many of the rules considering arbitration have changed. But for anyone considering this business I would recommend that you get a good understanding of such processes.
February 9, 2008
Court rules against Amway Arbitration
Posted by Truth
The Fifth Circuit US Court of Appeals has ruled against Amway/Quixtar in the Morrison case regarding the arbitration decision. From what I gather Morrison lost against Amway in arbitration (no surprise there) then objected to the arbitration when Amway went back to federal district court to get a judgement on the arbitration decision. The district court decided in Amway's favor, and Morrison appealed the ruling. The case ended up with the US Court of Appeals Fifth Circuit and the district courts ruling was reversed and the arbitration ruling was vacated.
The reversal of the decision seems to be mostly based off of the fact that the arbitration was invalid and unenforceable because Amway continued to reserve the right to modify or revoke the arbitration agreement at-will. So basically since Amway was not bound to the arbitration provision they could not enforce it on anyone else.
I have never been a fan of Amway's arbitration process since it always seemed like going to a card game with a stacked deck against you. From the way I understand it Amway trains the arbitrators, Amway could revoke or modify the arbitration provision at-will, and Amway hand-picks the arbitrators. Now I am no lawyer, but it seems to me if all of that is the way the Amway arbitration process works "fair" would not be the first word that would come to mind. So I must say I am happy with the decision and hope that it can possibly lead to a better process that is fair to all the parties involved.
You can read much more about the history of this case and view the actual documents at amquix.info website.
December 8, 2007
Numbers from Amway UK case
Posted by Truth
I got word that the Amway UK case has wrapped up and apparently a decision is expected in the next weeks. While looking up some information I ran across an article that posted some figures that came out during the case. I don't think the numbers show anything surprising. Basically the same old "a few got the most" that we have come to expect with Amway/Quixtar. Even the supporters agree with those kinds of numbers, but of course take the liberty and time to spin it so it doesn't sound so bad. At any rate here are the numbers and here is a link to the article, I leave you to decide for yourselves.
39,000
agents working for Amway
27,000
(71%) had no income
11,410
(30%) earned something
7,492
(of the 11,410) received average of £13.53 per year
101
agents received 75 per cent of bonuses
£116K
paid to top earner Trevor Lowe
26
number of years Mr Lowe was an agent
Source: Evidence at companies court hearing
May 24, 2007
Update on the UK
Posted by Truth
Today on the Amway Media Blog there is an update about what is going on in the UK involving complaints from the DTI. I will not repost the entire article here but will post some excerpts and have some comments about this update. You can go to the blog to read the entire article for yourself.
The first thing I noticed was that the DTI's complaint was against Amway, Network 21, and Britt WorldWide, and that the complaint was based off of a year long investigation. I guess that puts to bed Insider/IBOFightBack's argument that Network 21 is different from all the other tool organizations, and that this action by the DTI is a result of complaints from people who don't know the business. But that of course doesn't surprise me since I have been telling everyone that Insider is nothing more then a propaganda artist from the start. Time has just now taken it's toll, since you can't hide your true colors forever.
So now let me post some excerpts of this article and after each excerpt I will post my comments:
The heart of the DTI’s position, as we understand it, is that the business opportunity is promoted by incorporated and unincorporated organizations in a manner that does not reflect the financial rewards people are likely to earn when they participate in the Amway business.
Well if that is the heart of their position I would say the DTI is right on the money. How many times have you seen a video, or heard a Diamond talking about buying mansions, cars, vacations, etc. and paying cash for everything? Well if the average Diamond is making somewhere in the ballpark of $150K gross, then I would say that is a HUGE misrepresentation of the financial rewards people are likely to earn in Amway or Quixtar. Anyone remember Greg Fredericks? $250,000 in 12 months? I hope you are not naive enough to believe he was the only one saying such nonsense?
The DTI also objects to the manner and frequency in which meetings and BSMs are promoted by the sales organizations in conjunction with the Amway business opportunity.
...and once again the DTI is right on the money with this objection. How many times have you heard from former and current IBOs about how often tools are referred to and how little actual product sales are referred to? There is a real problem when the support materials are talked about and promoted more often then the actual business you signed up for in the first place, and that is exactly what goes on in many of the meetings and seminars.
Amway’s fault, according to the petition, lies in our failure to take sufficient action to prevent these abuses from occurring.
Looks like the DTI's year long investigation pretty much revealed exactly what has been being said for years. I agree that Amway and Quixtar for that matter are both at fault for failure to take action on these abuses. My hope is that finally some action is being taken and I hope in the end it amounts to more then just a bunch of saber rattling. I think those IBOs who join this organization because they are trying to better their lives and the lives of their families deserve better then just a bunch of tough talk.
There have been enough of these disappointments. They are serious distractions to the operations of the company, embarrassments to the many IBOs and Amway markets that provide exemplary service to the public, and a threat to the company’s long-term health.
Is there an echo in this blog? I don't mean to sound so cynical about this, but why does it take government action to get Amway to finally realize what has been being said by IBOs for years? Perhaps if Amway and Quixtar would actually listen to what is being said instead of parading the pompous ass Rob Davidson on camera talking about how the critics are just a bunch of people looking to get something for nothing, they could have stopped government organizations from bringing lawsuits in the first place.
Don't get me wrong, I am pleased that it seems action is finally beginning to take place in that organization, but I can't help but shake my head when the corporation acts like these complaints is news to them. It's been being said for years, and sadly it took a government agency bringing a lawsuit to spark action instead of IBO tales of abuse.
May 12, 2007
Amway not impressed with N21
Posted by Truth
Well the recent drama with Amway/UK has taken another turn and one that I find quite interesting to say the least. Anyone who has spent anytime in the Quixtar Blog forums may know a member who goes by the name of Insider. For those of you who do not know Insider is an Amway Distributor overseas, he defends both Amway and Quixtar, is part of Network 21 (N21), and runs a site called "The Truth About Quixtar" under the name "IBOFightBack". So now that we are all caught up...back to the story.
Recently on his site Insider posted a letter from Jim Dornan who, from what I understand, is the founder of Network 21. Not sure what the letter said exactly because Insider has since removed it. I will comment on that more in a bit. Well apparently Amway saw the letter as well and had something to say about it over at the Amway Media Blog.
Now the reason I find this interesting is because much of Insider's past efforts has been his defense of the Network 21 group. Often Insider would try and convince others that Network 21 did not operate anything like the Quixtar Motivational Organizations here in the US. As expected many people were skeptical of his claims, with some just outright dismissing his claims as bogus. Well now it appears Amway/UK has shown that others were right to be skeptical of Insider's claims. Some of the following tidbits from the Amway Media Blog's post don't bode well for Network 21:
In its complaint against Network 21, the DTI makes serious allegations about the way Network 21 represents the Amway business opportunity in the UK.
Action first. Not ducking, not dodging, not playing games of “not me.“ Self-reflection, and then action. That is how we are approaching this matter.
The spin that Network 21 is putting on this situation is not productive.
I do encourage all readers however to go on over to the Amway Media Blog and read the entire post for yourself. You can even read Insider/IBOFightBack's comments as well.
What is most curious to me however is that Insider has now removed the letter from his website. Amway has made it clear on their blog that they did not request the letter be removed and they were simply stating that they disagreed with what Jim Dornan had to say. No doubt having Amway disagree with a letter that Insider posted doesn't exactly bode well for Insider but in my opinion his removal of the letter after that fact, without Amway requesting that it be removed, only serves to show that he must not stand as firmly behind Network 21 as he once tried to make others believe.
This of course is just another example of why I strongly encourage everyone to get every side of this business you can before you make any decision about getting involved. Trust but verify! That goes for anything I write as well. Those who want you to know the truth won't take down letters they claim to stand behind no matter what someone else's opinion about it is. Interestingly enough though Insider still leaves up his hit pieces on Eric (aka Qblog) which are full of more holes then a hunk of swiss cheese. Somewhere down the line true colors will always come out.
May 10, 2007
Sharks are in the water
Posted by Truth
UPDATE: Dale has sent me an e-mail requesting that I remove or edit his e-mail address so that the "bots" don't pick it up and spam him to death. I wonder if Dale thought about that before sending out his own spam e-mail. I don't recall asking for an e-mail about how great his opportunity is compared to Quixtar or Amway. At any rate I will have mercy on Dale and do as he wishes, but I thought this was a nice lesson in "what comes around goes around." I hope there were not too many bots that picked up his e-mail address before I could make the change.
Well it was bound to happen but I didn't think I would be the recipient of one of the e-mails. Well a gentleman by the name of Dave Windle sent me an e-mail. The entire e-mail follows with only his phone number blanked out:
Hi Drew:
Not sure if you are aware of this, but Amway UK (the business operates as Amway outside of Canada and the US where it operates as Quixtar) has just implemented the first stage of a company wide, world wide clamp down on the Business Support Materials (BSM) business.
The BSM business is extremely lucrative for the big "king pin" diamonds and is causing massive problems for the business. It has for years - that's one of the main reasons why we as Emeralds, who were full time in the business decided to become side line rather than active IBOs. There are other reasons as well, that I'd be pleased to discuss with you.
Have a look at the email sent to UK IBOs and contact me if you'd like to discuss an alternative that we have moved over to with several other Emeralds and other high pins, with a free support system, fairly priced advertising tools, free prospecting web sites, free seminars, a pay plan that pays out more than double what the Quixtar Plan pays and with 100%+ growth per year, not the current 1% per year for Quixtar.
Letter: from Ben Woodward Branch Manager Amway UK UK/ROI IBO
Communication
May 4, 2007
To: UK/ROI IBO Leader
From: Ben Woodward, Branch Manager, Amway UK
RE: Significant change to Amway's mode of operations in UK/Republic of Ireland.
This letter is to inform you of significant changes to the way Amway will conduct its business in the UK and Republic of Ireland. These changes are effective immediately. While these changes may cause short-term challenges for some of our IBOs, we strongly believe the changes will make our long-term business in the UK/RoI stronger.
Effective Immediately: 4 May 07.
Amway will prohibit the production, sale or promotion of BSM that are not authorized and distributed by Amway; this includes websites. This includes any BSM (books, tapes, meetings, CD's, websites) that have been already been approved by Amway UK/RoI. They are now considered unauthorized for use.
All meetings for which an entry fee is charged are suspended until Amway has approved, in writing, the meeting and its content;
Amway has imposed a moratorium on sponsoring new IBOs for at least 60 days and until current IBOs are re-trained and re-qualified; We are evaluating all costs associated with joining Amway;
We are also sanctioning a number of IBOs based on contract violations that have come to our attention.
Failure to comply with the above mentioned points 1 to 3 will lead to a suspension and/or termination of the respective IBO contract. Please also note that Amway is in no way limited to these sanctions, but can impose further corrective or punitive measures.
In addition, the company is announcing a thorough review of its business practices globally with the goal of ensuring a consistent, rigorously enforced set of rules and regulations governs its relationships with IBOs and consumers.
That global audit has begun, and we expect it to be completed in June, and will share the results with you later this summer.
These are important steps, but in some ways, they are not surprising ones. Many of you know that for the past 10 years, Amway has been moving to exert more control over the way we do business globally.
In newer markets that has meant, for example, outright bans or tight restrictions on the sale of non-company BSMs and the requirement of a more consistent, approved messaging and branding by IBOs about the Amway business opportunity.
While most changes in other markets have been carried out gradually around the world according to our timetable, we need to move more quickly here. This is in response to serious concerns raised about Amway by the Department of Trade and Industry (DTI) following the receipt of complaints about BSMs and misrepresentation of the business to prospective IBOs.
At this time, we can not specify when sponsoring will be allowed to resume. We will continue to communicate with key international and local IBO leadership to update them on developments of a new operational mode in UK and Republic of Ireland.
Enquiries
For example, if any IBO has a planned meeting for which tickets have been sold (that is required to be cancelled and ticket purchases refunded), or they have unsold inventory of BSM, or have unsold Starter kits, or have completed applications not yet submitted to Amway, they may contact the dedicated enquiry telephone number 01908-629400 (press option 4).
In the following weeks, we will seek to meet with you personally to discuss the implications of this policy change and respond to any questions you may have. Meanwhile, please feel free to call me at 01908-629404.
Amway has been in the UK/RoI for more than 30 years, and today is a strong, growing £13 million business with more than 100 staff and 30,000 IBOs. We are entering into a challenging period of time.
But we believe in this business, we believe in our values and we believe in our IBOs. We are committed to making the changes we need to make in order to ensure the continued growth and success of Amway in the UK/RoI.
BEN WOODWARD
Branch Manager UK / RoI
Here's what Networking Marketing expert Ty Tribble has stated as well:
"...this is a shot over the bow of Quixtar in the U.S. This is about Alticor showing the IBO Leaders (Britt , Winters , Puryear , Woodward , Yager , etc) that the company is serious about cleaning up the training and tools mess.
If the old school tools boys don't clean up their act, it is now apparent that the company will step in and clean house.
But...(you knew that was coming, didn't you?)
But, Quixtar is not nearly as lucrative as an opportunity if you remove the tools income that begins in many cases at the Platinum level. I would even go as far as saying that the tools income is what keeps Amway/Quixtar leaders from leaving for a different company with a better compensation plan.
Quixtar pays out roughly 30% back to it's IBO base, yet the average of the top 30 companies in the industry is roughly 37% payout. Why would IBO Leaders stick around Amway/Quixtar for years when there is more money to be made elsewhere? It's all about the secondary business of books, CDs, seminars, voice mail, and web sites, collectively know as the tools business. Take away the tools business and Quixtar Leaders are paid 20% (a conservative number) less than leaders in other companies for the same volume.
The IBO leaders are in a bit of a bind. They clean up their act or the leaders keep on trucking and Quixtar comes in and cleans up. Either way the leaders stand to lose a lot of money.
Will all of this be better for the individual Amway/Quixtar IBO? Probably. Would the individual Quixtar IBO be better off by finding a new opportunity at this point? Probably. I would be willing to bet that BIG TIME IBO leaders are already looking around at other opportunities."
Feel free to contact me if you'd like to discuss an alternative that we have moved over to with several other Emerald and other high pins.
___________________
Dale Windle
Day: XXX-XXX-XXXX
Eve: XXX-XXX-XXXX
Find all the meeting dates, free training system and free mp3s audio downloads at our support web site - ask me for the login details.
All the news about what is going on in the UK is interesting. I have my own comments and thoughts that I will write in a later post. By the way I checked out Dave's site he has put down for his e-mail address and for a business who claims to have a better system then Amway/Quixtar he might want to try and get his links fixed. Too many page not found errors on that site when clicking links. At any rate it is apparent that the sharks are in the waters and some are smelling blood over the Amway/UK news.
November 17, 2006
DeVos Loss, Amway's Gain
Posted by David Robison
Interesting headline from a quote by Alticor spokesman, Rob Zeiger, "This has been nothing but a positive for our company."
From the article:The Grand Rapids Press titles it "Election,'nothing but a positive'".
"Alticor Inc. was dragged into the governor's race when Dick DeVos, its former chief executive and son of the founder, threw in his hat for the state's top job.
And for the first time, the company fought back to protect its image and that of its subsidiaries, including Amway, with a series of commercials and blistering rebuttals to Democratic charges it shipped jobs overseas.
The shift was major for the company, which in the past quietly took lumps from critics, preferring to suffer in solitude rather than risk the spotlight.
Just because the general election is over, don't expect Alticor Inc. to crawl back into its shell."
Zeiger goes on to explain, "It reintroduced us to a lot of people. It also showed us how much farther we have to go."
The article says that after the "I Am Amway" ads began to run; Alticor employees asked why the campaign had not ran 20 years ago. As an IBO, I agree. Luckily, Alticor plans to continue running the ads through the end of the year, as well as the new Quixtar ads appearing on TV and magazines.
Further in the article, Zeiger says,
..."We are also taking some of the lessons that we learned, to talk to our colleagues in other parts of the world,"
He said the lack of information that came out of the company before the election wasn't because of "bad intention."
"It was partially because we are a private company, and we were happy to stay out of the limelight," Zeiger said. "Part of it was that product advertising and advertising to attract distributors were not always seen as effective for us. We're rethinking that."
Zeiger said the company didn't realize the importance of getting its message out.
The company also launched a blog to respond to criticism.
It's a real blog, complete with comments and I have to say it's pretty good reading and one of the writers is pretty funny.
The article also quotes Bill McKendry, founder and chief creative officer of Grand Rapids advertising agency, Hanon McKendry.
"Amway has a history of overcoming the odds," he said. "They just need to get out and manage their image and brand more. It's like politics: If you let the other side define who you are, you are not going to get the results you want."
McKendry said Alticor is a great company and a great employer, but questioned the title of its advertising campaign.
Running an "I Am Amway" campaign after abandoning the Amway name in the U.S. in favor of Alticor and Quixtar, "adds to the confusion," he said. "If they say they are not Amway anymore, and then try to build the Quixtar and Alticor brands, why are they coming out with an "I Am Amway" campaign?"
In my opinion, McKendry should already know the answer to this question for two reasons.
First, If you followed the Devos-Granholm race, then you know that DeVos was tagged as "the Amway guy" early in the race; not the Alticor guy or the Quixtar guy.
Second, if you live in a close knit community or small town, then you know that the place that changed its name 15 years ago is still called by its original name by the locals.
Alticor attacked the issue as it was presented to them; as an "Amway" issue. They fought hard to prevent the attacks against DeVos, the Amway guy" from being attacks against "Amway" the company, even if the name had changed.
To me, and my biased IBO view, I'd say that Alticor, Amway, and Quixtar are taking to heart all the comments on blogs like these, and really striving for a change. From their Accreditation Program; to an end to shying away from the Press; it looks like some transparency is starting to breakthrough the opaque-ness, that was Alticor.
Heck, even Kia over at The Real Quixtar Blog is redesigning his blog to add comments, trackbacks, and RSS feeds. And Beth Dornan, (be still, my beating heart) is moving her blog to a dedicated website.
Maybe, just maybe, DeVos' loss will be Quixtar and Amway IBOs' gain, as well.
September 10, 2006
I've Been Amwayed
Posted by QBlog
September 2, 2006
How Amway Does Sales
Posted by Preston
I'm from Washington State - and am young. I had never heard of Amway until I joined Quixtar. From the first meetings I couldn't understand why people kept having to deflect criticism about being a cult. I didn't know where they came from. Thats why I have been so interested in Amway's advertising campaign, and just how closely they seem to tie with the gubernatorial race.
At any rate, I had to chuckle when I read, yet again, one more select quote that has so much in common with countless others. Amway's public perception campaign might go a little better if they extended it to Quixtar. After all, it is not like Alticor tries to hide the relationship, unlike other IBO's might try to dodge the question.
"The issue with Amway was never the quality of their products or the employees that make the products. It's the business practices and how they do their sales,"Sarpolus said.
September 1, 2006
Amway TV Commercials
Posted by QBlog
Is it just me or does it seem like these TV ads are more of a PR move to help out Dick DeVos than an effort to really market the Amway brand?
Amway: We're Your Neighbors
Posted by David Robison
Nope, it's not as catchy of a phrase as "the pause that refreshes" or as direct as "15 minutes could save you hundreds on auto insurance," but it is the slogan used in an Amway television commercial.
A commercial that didn't air on some late night Andy Griffith re-run on a WB affiliate; but it did air during major televised NFL football games.
The commercial featured the standard "heartland" instrumental score, with shots of Amway distributors (actors) working in their daily jobs. I specifically remember the farmer on his tractor in the field. And the voice-over was something like "What kind of people are Amway distributors?" (paraphrased from memory) and it ended with a distributor and a kid sitting somewhere peaceful and serene (maybe it was the farmer) and then "Amway" would appear on the screen with the voice-over saying Amway... We're Your Neighbors."
Since I announced Quixtar would start an advertising campaign featuring both TV and print ads in the coming months, there's been some talk about how Quixtar "doesn't advertise." But, "doesn't advertise" doesn't mean "would never advertise" or "have never advertised."
Beth Dornan at Inside Quixtar Communications stated:
"It's true that Quixtar hasn't advertised since its launch in 1999. But Amway did, with a modest campaign that ended in the late 1990s. At the beginning of the decade the focus was on the environment, with a series in Time that showcased a relationship with the National Wildlife Federation and a Newsweek series that encouraged schools to develop environmental programs and be rewarded through the "Class Act" environmental competition. Ads also were featured in Ebony and other pubs.
...While we aren't going to be a major advertiser, helping increase awareness and understanding of Quixtar and our products will benefit all IBO businesses."
Well, this reminded me of a lot of advertising that Amway (the folks that brought you Quixtar) has done in the past. Even Beth Dornan might not be aware of.
This advertising was way before the World-Wide Web was popular, so I can't provide you with many specific links, you'll just have to trust me; I'm wearing that new cologne.
Amway ran advertisements in publications such as the Reader's Digest. These ads pictured a particular room in a house, with the headline: "How many Amway products?" Usually, the obvious SA-8 or LOC was visible but, many more were in plain sight, including catalog merchandise. At the bottom of the ad was a B&W graphic to tell you how many were in the ad and where they were located.
Amway infomercials? Yep. They existed, too. A 20-minute TV program usually aired on a "minor" cable network of the time, showing lavish lifestyles, yachts, fine motor cars, and distributors living the good life and explaining how it all was because of Amway.
Amway even publicized the airings and featured schedules in the "Amagram" magazine sent to distributors, so you could arrange meetings to correspond with the episodes. My small town did not have cable, so I drove to a friend's house and made them endure the program so I could be "in the loop."
Amway was a sponsor of the Paul Harvey radio program.
Amway sponsored a syndicated TV program called "Inside Business" in cooperation with the US Chamber of Commerce.
Amway sponsored an educational program, aimed at children, on economics called "The Incredible Bread Machine." And while this was more of a live, in-school promotion, rather than a blatant advertisement, it was highly publicized.
Of course, my favorite Amway advertisement was the one you could only catch a glimpse of as it traveled 212MPH around an Indy Car track. Amway's Winning Spirit driven by Scott Brayton could be seen every Sunday in the early 1990s on TV during race season.
And lest we forget, Amway even allowed distributors to advertise.
Yep, the Amway Business Manual of the 1980s contained pages of "ad copy" pre-approved for newspaper classifieds. All the distributor had to do was insert his name and phone number. Direct Distributors (Quixtar Platinums) could even order audio tapes ready for broadcast on the distributor's local radio stations.
Magazine and newspaper "ad slicks" were also available for any distributor to customize with name address and phone number for local publication. I placed a few of those myself in 1991.
So, Quixtar maybe doesn't have a history of its own in mainstream media advertising and this is new territory for the company; but it's foundation is no stranger to advertising.
August 5, 2006
"...never say never on anything."
Posted by Preston
An interesting article came across my Google Alerts yesterday that I felt enticed to read. The headline "This is not their fathers' Amway" caught my attention. A few things stuck out in my head as things that make you say, "Hmm."
- Now $4 out of every $5 of the company's revenue comes from foreign countries.
- DeVos was president of Alticor/Amway from 1993 until 2002, during which time the company eliminated around 1,400 U.S. jobs - including about 1,000 in Michigan
- "...in the United States, it (Alticor's business) has been flat to down..." says Ben Rudolph, a marketing professor at Grand Valley State University
- 3 million distributors worldwide
- Alticor... reported revenues of $6.4 billion in fiscal 2005. About $5 billion came from outside the U.S.
And finally,
The families say they see the company remaining privately held, believing it gives them a strategic advantage in long-term planning. But they didn't rule out the possibility of a change in the future.
"As a family, we look at ourselves as remaining private but we've also learned over the years never say never on anything," Van Andel says.
What would happen to the non-accredited A/QMO's line about "how well a business is doing since it is privately held at the 6 billion mark?" Just how well do you think Alticor would do in the US if it were taken public, given that $4 of every $5 is made outside the United States? Can it really be called "The American Way" when American's themselves seem to be rejecting the business model?
May 19, 2004
Deconstructing the Postma Memo
Posted by QBlog
The "Postma Memo" (pdf) is a brief and rather dry Amway document examining the Bill Britt and Dexter Yager motivational businesses. It was written in 1983 by Ed Postma, formerly Amway's business conduct manager, and provides a glimpse into the hidden conflict between the Amway corporation and the rapidly growing "tool business."
Relationships are sacred
The first thing we learn from the memo is that relationships within the Britt/Yager systems are sacred.
...It is also customary for this line of sponsorship to consistently teach that the relationships in a line of sponsorship are sacred...
...So, while friendships are being developed, a dependency is also being created. It is this aspect of their methodology, that has allowed for charges of "mind control."
The "dependency" that Postma mentions ultimately suppresses individuality and creativity. The downline is taught that the upline should be the only source of information and guidance. Postma goes on to say that creativity in the Britt/Yager system provides a "chance of failure" and failure is not allowed if their business is to be credible.
Don't trust anyone... except your upline
Another characteristic of the Britt/Yager systems is the culture of mistrust and suspicion towards anyone outside of their specific Line of Sponsorship (LoS), including the Amway corporation itself. Only the upline organization is to be trusted. Postma describes a culture teaching that the Amway corporation is out of touch with the realities of the Amway business and as a result can't provide the type of support, information and advice needed to succeed as a Distributor. However, Postma clearly disagrees with such ideas and even suggests that the corporation could provide superior motivation to the Distributors.
It has been my judgment on observations, that they do not do a better meeting than we do, nor can they provide the same type of motivation as we do. However, in attempting to convince the corporation to stay out of the motivation business, it allows them to do two things: first, it further isolates the business, second, it allows them to operate a motivation business with little or no competition.
Motivation is where the big money is made
Postma makes it clear that the primary source of revenue for Britt/Yager Diamonds is the tool business and not the distribution of Amway products.
If there are any discussions of any length with the Diamonds utilizing this system, it becomes clear that although they realize that they are Amway distributors, they consider their personal business to be the motivation (tool) business. I think there is little question that is where the big money is made.
Postma then outlines five categories that constitute the motivation business.
- Tapes and Books - "At that level (Direct), the tool business subsidizes the Amway business"
- Rallies - "It is not uncommon for the profits on these functions to exceed $25,000 to $50,000 for a weekend or $250,000 for a Free Enterprise night."
- Accessories - "...accessories (jewelry, clothing, and automobiles) are made available to distributors so that they may appear successful. It is considered extremely important for Diamonds to show material success in the business."
- Counseling - "Counseling goes on continually with the upline also causing dependency."
- Moving Up - "It is important to demonstrate success as the system (not the Amway business) allows."
"This business will crumble under its own weight"
Obviously Postma miscalculated the resilience of the Britt/Yager motivation businesses. In his summary, Postma predicts that "...anything that is done by the corporation that will cause conflict or competition with this business could cause a major split. This business will crumble under its own weight..." He then lists three reasons that the motivation business will crumble:
- Rights of the Directs - "The biggest fear that Diamonds have in this system is that the Directs will take Rich's speeches seriously, become "little Napolean," and cut off their ability to move the motivation business downline..."
- Greed - "Ego could destroy the traditional system. The system has encouraged "sponsoring" up so much that in many cases, the downline leader is smarter, more ambitious, and more ego bound than the upline."
- The Tool business (motivation) is illegal - "Unlike the Koscot method of marketing, the MLM system moves a product to an ultimate consumer outside of the business structure; i.e., a customer. Although the Amway business is legal (no question), the tool business is not (my conclusion)."
The memo concludes with what appears to be a plan of action. Postma states that "with proper prodding, this business (tool business) will fail." Did that prodding ever occur? Was there ever any plan to initiate the suggested prodding? If so, it was obviously unsuccessful because the Britt/Yager motivation business is alive and well today, nearly 21 years after the Postma Memo was written.