« Happy Thanksgiving! | Main | Crosslining is fun! »
November 29, 2007
Question your upline
By Truth in A/QMOs
Just about everyone I have ever talked to who has been in Quixtar has agreed that one of the standing rules was to never question your upline. I always get a little uneasy when someone tries to put themselves in a position to never be questioned or challenged. It seems as if they have something to hide, that they don't want exposed.
Now I can understand that it can be disruptive for someone to come into a group and start causing issues by questioning every last piece of advice given by an upline, especially if that is being done in the group. But unfortunately it seems all too often that is not the reason for this "rule" if you will. Too often this rule seems like a good way to get downline IBOs to do, act, and dare I say purchase the way the uplines want them to.
But if you are an IBO you should never forget that the "I" stands for Independent. Now I am all for teamwork and I understand teamwork, but if you are an IBO I would think that your first priority would be the profitability of your business. With that in mind if your upline is giving you advice that you are not very sure of I think it would be in your best interests to ask all the questions you can until you are sure you either want to do this or not.
In many cases upline IBOs are no better at business then the IBOs under them. Granted many uplines have had some experiences that one can benefit from, but in no way do I see that as a reason to never question them. Learn from their mistakes, get feedback on ideas you have, even listen to what they say you should be doing with your business. All of those things can serve you well in the long run. But never forget this is your business, not your upline's and they should never be put above being questioned. After all, if their advice was sound they wouldn't care about any questions.
Comments
As an active IBO sympathetic to Quixtar/The systems, I absolutely agree with this.
BWW for example, had gotten out of hand, and it was no longer edifying (which is perfectly understandable and necessary), but DEIFYING.
Too often, information or monitoring of one's business is called "passing negative".
That has to stop, or we'll forever have disgruntled ex-IBOs on boards like this talking about cult this, cult that.
Neither have I been told throughout the educational system empowering IBOs to never question. Au contraire, I have been told to seek with an open mind and to ignore negative people with a close mind. Big difference. In the end, it's how you perceive it and how you feel about yourself. If you feel good, you will succeed otherwise you will become an ill critic, not a good critic.
"Neither have I been told throughout the educational system empowering IBOs to never question. Au contraire, I have been told to seek with an open mind and to ignore negative people with a close mind."
Seek with open mind is often portrayed as "if anybody has any sense, they'd be an IBO or else they're...stupid".
Many standing orders in our system had direct quotes "don't question anything". Just do what your upline says. Check everything, "buying a house, etc". Now some of what they are saying might be sensationalistic but it is harmful when endorsed as a matter of policy by a training system. What results is that new people quit and come to these boards, or they become zombies who don't think.
The problem is when "negative" is tagged onto ANYTHING that questions something about the business, system, etc. i.e. asking your upline about the UK situation, or about how come John Crowe CDs aren't available is called "talking negative and not worrying about the business". Walkman, ask yourself why an entire organization does not know anything about the opportunity zone blogs, or that the organization they are a part of is not a part of the UK. Why not open dialogue and updates, like normal business partners and organizations do?
Accreditation with teeth is the best thing that could happen to the business. "Easy money"..."you dont't have to do anything"...."we dont' sell"..."Satan & Liberals"...etc. These are real issues that are legitimate, that get swept under the rug of "negative" by many uplines. It is forcing some serious re-examination.
"In the end, it's how you perceive it and how you feel about yourself. If you feel good, you will succeed otherwise you will become an ill critic, not a good critic."
What's so important about "feeling good" in this business?
walkman,
So what you are saying is you were told never to question upline?
"I have been told to seek with an open mind and to ignore negative people with a close mind." = Quixtarese for "I was told to wholly embrace and except the system, never question it, and ignore people who do."
i disagree i am ibo they tell you to do certain things because they want you to succeed and obiviously your upline has success so they want share that with you with what they done and the downline can question thats point the more question the more people can succeed its just people with no knowlege or no drive can understand or do this is coming from a downline ibo
There's no "I", in "Team".
I as in "independent"
No there is no I in Team.
But there is ME!
"Neither have I been told throughout the educational system empowering IBOs to never question. Au contraire, I have been told to seek with an open mind and to ignore negative people with a close mind."
Sorry there is no difference. As an IBO I know that negative means "anything your upline hasn't told you". By the way, with the name change back to Amway we will all be "ABO" not "IBO". So independence is no longer an option. I know your upline hasn't told you so just check the corporation website. All IBOs need to read the new SA4400
walkman writes: "In the end, it's how you perceive it and how you feel about yourself."
No, in the end it's all about profit and loss.
Well, it is IF we're talking about a business, one whose expenses can be deducted against income on your tax return. If you're in a self-help group or fraternal order, then by all means let the focus be perception and feeling good. But those dues and expenses aren't tax deductible.
Which one are you participating in, walkman?
Your response indicates you are paticipating in a club or hobby. I wonder what your Schedule C says?
I was always told when I was an IBO to ignore the negative people in my life, and negative was questioning the business. So, let me get this straight: I'm supposed to ignore my parents advice, my friends advice (if they won't help you make money, they aren't your friends) and every one else that isn't in the "Business". All in all, I don't have a problem with a lot of the aspects of the business, but what I do have a problem with is people telling other people how to think. What's good for you may not be good for me. since I decided to get out, I only talk to one of my former upline regularly. Weren't they supposed to be my friend no matter what? But I guess since I don't come around anymore I am "Negative". Nice. Real nice.
I was always told when I was an IBO to ignore the negative people in my life, and negative was questioning the business. So, let me get this straight: I'm supposed to ignore my parents advice, my friends advice (if they won't help you make money, they aren't your friends) and every one else that isn't in the "Business". All in all, I don't have a problem with a lot of the aspects of the business, but what I do have a problem with is people telling other people how to think. What's good for you may not be good for me. since I decided to get out, I only talk to one of my former upline regularly. Weren't they supposed to be my friend no matter what? But I guess since I don't come around anymore I am "Negative". Nice. Real nice.
Just make sure you don't take tax advice from your upline, unless they are an accountant. I wonder how your upline is going to spin the switch back to Amway. Because, I was always told when I was an IBO that it wasn't Amway, and I was supposed to tell people that it wasn't Amway.
another issue is whether or not they are actually qualifying at the pin they are promoted at. Many IBO 'leaders' have an unhealthy attachment to the significance they get from 'teaching from a pin'. I have seen in both upline and downline in my organisation.
"Neither have I been told throughout the educational system empowering IBOs to never question. Au contraire, I have been told to seek with an open mind and to ignore negative people with a close mind. Big difference. In the end, it's how you perceive it and how you feel about yourself. If you feel good, you will succeed otherwise you will become an ill critic, not a good critic."
"Au contraire, I have been told to seek with an open mind and to ignore negative people with a close mind. Big difference."
Yes my experience was that anyone who questioned the business, even family members or prospects who were not interested (some highly successful people)were called losers. So it translates to me that anyone who does not see things the way they do is close minded. Au contraire, it seems the shoe is on the other foot. How close minded it is to call someone a loser for not seeing things the way one does?
I am a IBO myself and i got to say its great. I have never been told to not question my upline. They are there to help you and advise you. They help you by making sure that what they do can be duplicatable by there downline. Those who complain about it either had bad upline, were in the wrong organazation, or just were lazy and never did anything so they become bitter and try to ruin the creditability of there upline or organazation. The way i see it is that quixtar is very legatimate otherwise all these great fortune 500 companies would not alline themselves with quixtar. I am personally part of the World Wide Dream Builders organazation. From what i have seen they are probably the best out of the other organazations.
"I have been told to seek with an open mind and to ignore negative people with a close mind."
So at what point do you pass from having an open mind to becoming negative with a close [sic] mind. Are you saying that the hundreds of ex IBOs on this blog have made that transition? Some of the folks blogging here have actually reached some pretty high levels of success. Did their success suddenly change them from open minded to closed negative minded. Seems the opposite would be true, wouldn't you agree?
Starting with Team in Focus and its 25 Diamonds in 2002, now TEAM in 2007 and its diamonds, sure are a lot of people making an interested transition from open minded about the business to close minded....
Bravo Truth! Well written. I agree wholeheartedly.
I am with WWDB. Although I have not experienced this particular phenomenon, I know others have. I have always disagreed with that practice. Sound advice, based on experience (and a history of a strong business & profit!) is the best thing to receive from you upline.
I have always recommended to use "common sense" and do what works best for YOUR family. Not necessarily your upline's family.
Good post!
You shouldn't *criticize or question* your upline in public. Respecting your upline enough to pull them aside later is what shows your upline and your downlines that you care about that person's ego. You don't PLAY to their ego, but you don't trounce upon it either.
"Never questioning your upline" is a fictitious fairytale told by IBOs who were either taught wrong or don't have the strength to help another along without having to be "right".
An upline who tells their "downlines" to never question them is setting himself and his downlines up for failure. How can you build a team when your downlines don't trust you enough to tell you what's going on? How can you build a team when you don't trust your downlines enough to listen to them?
No. Building a business on your ego is the quickest way to failure.
KG, it's not a fictitious fairy tale, it's happened to thousands, heck maybe HUNDREDS of thousands of people.
I don't know how long you've been in or what level you're at, but up until very recently, IBO's were in the dark about everything.
I agree with your ego comment though.
Pretty tough to have an ego when people are laughing their asses off at Amway's pricing structure while you attempt to find a line to justify it.
there is no i in TEAM- Now there is no TEAM.
rocket... I'm not saying that some IBOs were not told that. What I'm saying is that the concept of not questioning your upline is fictitious and stupid. It's not team-based logic. It's just not logical period. There have been MANY ego-driven IBOs who told that lie to their downlines. However, I've heard from the top of the leadership that that kind of BS isn't the right way to go... besides the fact that I'm too opinionated NOT to express my views upon things.
So, yes... it is fictitious, because it isn't true... however, some poorly trained or ego-driven IBOs have abused their position in order to further their own goals. Thus, you have some people who have been turned off because of the inter-political BS not inherent to the value system.
There is a way to go about questioning though. THAT’S where you draw the line and begin to develop trust among your organization. This is a peculiar business, but it’s still a business.
That's good to hear you won't put up with that crap, KG.
I see now what you were trying to say.
Hopefully the Corp. will also set aside it's egos and high profit margins to make the business more lucrative for people as well.
Granted I'm in Amway and not Quixtar, but some of my upline is in Quixtar - and I've never ever been told "never question your upline", indeed the exact opposite. As an upline I've never told that to my downline either.
Posted by: ibofightback | November 29, 2007 10:35 AM