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May 27, 2007
A Sprinkle of Negative
By Truth in Quixtar
Around a week ago I wrote a piece about the first story that was posted over at the True IBO Stories blog in the Opportunity Zone. Of course I saw it as a bad start since the author of the story was calling his friends "broke", critical people "losers", and apparently left his wife out of the loop on his decision.
Well this past Monday Nick Katsarelas, who is the one who posts the stories on the blog, responded to Insider's comment, and my article about his decision to leave the terminology in place. You can go over to the blog to see his comment in full. I do have one little excerpt from his comment that I would like to respond to:
When I edited the Spiro's story, I left in the passage you referenced because I felt it bolstered Steve's explanation of how he doggedly pursued the business opportunity. He did what many people do when they don't want to be deterred from a goal: He surrounded himself with positive people who supported his pursuit.
I of course appreciate seeing Nick respond, giving certainly a better understanding of why it was left in and his thinking. My response to this is not necessarily addressed directly to Nick, but rather as a general response to those who hold the ideal that in order to achieve a goal you need to keep away from the naysayers.
On one hand I agree that being around a bunch of negative people all the time while you are pursuing a goal is no fun at all. It's hard enough to achieve your goal, you certainly don't need constant hammering in your ear about why you shouldn't or can't do it. However, on the other hand this concept can be taken too far in my opinion and having a little negative around just might actually come to benefit you if you know how to handle it.
After leaving Quixtar my desire to own and operate my own business didn't go away I just focused it towards something that I had a passion for. Unlike how I was taught in Quixtar however I never blocked out the negative, or ignored it. Heck in some cases I actually went looking for it. What I knew, is that no matter what anyone had to say about the business that I was pursuing, I was going to do it anyway. That is what happens when you get involved in something you have a passion for. If you are truly passionate about what you do, negative shouldn't be a factor.
What I had found out though is that I actually learned many good things from the negative that I would hear and read about. I learned about some of the challenges that were potentially ahead, I learned about the mistakes of others, and was able to see ways to improve on or avoid the issue all together. Negative even from those who tried to discourage me was a learning experience because I asked the key question of WHY? "It's too hard to break into that industry." "WHY?" etc. The other negative that I just thought was silly I was able to laugh at and thank the person for their concern about me.
So I started thinking at that point why was negative such a taboo in Quixtar? So what if your new downline reads Scott Larsen's site? So what if they see the Dateline special tommorow on You Tube? Who cares if their friends tell them about their brother's, friend's, daughter's, mother's, uncle's, cat's, bird who signed up and lost all their money? It's going to happen eventually so wouldn't you rather they see it now and decide they want nothing to do with it, instead of later after you invested your time into them?
I am afraid the comments made in that first IBO story do not explain how someone doggedly pursued a business opportunity. As far as I am concerned it explained how someone made a decision based upon half the information, and most certainly missed out on some good information that more then likely could have made him more profitable, and at a faster rate.
If you are an IBO the first question you need to ask yourself is are you passionate about what you are doing. If the answer is no, then you need to ask yourself if you are passionate enough about what you are using Quixtar to get that you are willing to put up with it. If the answer is no then you need to quit and find something you are passionate about. I promise you, there is something out there you can make good money at that you have a passion for.
Finally, don't ignore or try to avoid negative. Now use some common sense and understand that I am not saying only associate with negative folks. Associate with all people, and don't be afraid of their opinions. Only those that are weak in their convictions will try and eliminate negative opinions, those who are passionate about what they are doing will listen, see if there is something to be learned, and move on.
Comments
I joined with skeptism, but was so much wanting a change, an easier life later thru 'residual' income, that I stayed along, and would sacrifice.
I also became convinced thru all the idealism, religion and patriotism that the business received a bad rap, and that it was misunderstood.
On paper, it looked like it SHOULD work. In fact it looked impossible not to work.
No amount of reading negative info would have changed my mind, as the upline and leaders were very smooth, sincere, and seemingly philanthropic.
Five years later, after stopping the tapes, a thorough re-evaluation of everything from pricing, pv ratios, quotas, so called 'training' materials, seminars and conferences (cost of AND profit from), made me think otherwise.
It was AFTER I quit that I realized what the business really consisted of.
1. the numbers didn't play out as demonstrated.
2. the income projections could drop by HALF, if not structured as demonstrated.
3. growth was not nearly as fast as they professed (in fact I think it is declining)
4. Not all "Pin" winners still qualify
5. the excessive consumption of repetetive tapes/cds and selected readings 'brainwash' you into believing in what you are doing.
6. 'Negative' reactions from the public were blamed on 'other' Organizations or OTHER Mlms, when in fact the stories are the SAME from everyone.
The truth, in my opinion is that this is an outdated business model. It made sense when it 1st began. Door to door sales, wife was home, families had one car and so on. The Motivational guys kept it going longer than it would have survived due to shrewd manipulation of people FEARS, and 'Dreams'. They cloaked themselves in religion, family values, patriotism, and most recently the 'Internet' itself.
The Internet actually helped expose how similar everyone's experiences have been.
This is an outdated business model, kept alive and well by huge motivational organizations, playing on peoples FEARS as well as DREAMS.
Trying to go back to it's roots by 'Selling' instead of recruiting, is like going back to dial phones (instead of cell) and fax machines (instead of email).
Best to find another kind of 'Independent home based business' that focuses on the consumer's NEEDS, not FEARS and DREAMS.
I've really never understood the "fear" most AMOs have of the "competition" . Several years ago I was employed by a company that sold sales training. The first 90 days on the job were spent going though out competitions programs, and reading the "cons" of our class evuations and follow-ups. Why? So we understood what our weaknesses were. That gave us an opportunity to deal with the majority of our prospects objections in our presentation, and we also knew how to emphasize our strengths against our competition's weaknesses. I can't imagine sending a new recruit out to prospect someone with only visions of sugarplums in his head and no real ability to deal with the obvious objections he is going to receive. No wonder their is so much human carnage in this business.
The same idea worked well in our Amway business, helping us to build a PSDD in 16 months with ruby volume. The reason we quit was because our Upline Diamond turned out to be a sleaze, telling us how wonderful this buisiness was for a marriage, while he was doinkin' his office manager.
Of course Quixtar will include this statement. They and the AMOs cannot afford for any person to take a 10 minute rational look at this "opportunity" because that is how long it would take to discover that this is the absolute worst business model in the world. Just like the UK debacle. Everything that has been in the UK by the AMOs there is being done in the USA. Yet, they are really "going to get a handle" on abuses in the UK. What about the USA? What about the obvious fraud of showing mansions bought by tool money but publicly professing it was bought with Quixtar money. That is fraud. Quixtar know it and has known it a long time. But they too are more interested in their money than any new IBO.
I couldn't agree more, Drew.
This has been one of my biggest pet-peeves with this business. This goofy 'avoidance' of all things "negative".
I personally know a lot of 'entrepreneurs', as well as have a business that provides a service to a lot of 'entrepreneurs/small-businessmen', and NEVER have I heard them suggest that a business opportunity should be analysed by looking ONLY at the "positive" aspects of a business.
The CARDINAL rule of 'business-analysis' is this - "It is the 'negative' aspects of a business that can 'kill' a business."
One quality I have seen in every 'real' businessman (not your average ponzi-scheme peddler), is a healthy degree of skepticism.
This is not to suggest that one should always surround oneself with 'cynics', or should take advice ONLY from 'negative' sources.
The point is that a proper 'business-analysis' involves getting BOTH sides of an issue
- 'negative' AND 'positive' -
and then, verifying the authenticity of both opinions and weighing both to see which one outweighs the other.
Whether the "negative" is strong enough to 'kill' the business.
Right, both of you.
If you isolate yourself from information that is contrary to what you're being taught, then you don't know what the other side actually is. And if you don't know what it is, you cannot judge its merits accurately. "Positive" and "negative" can only be judged in context, in the presence of both.
You might be doing something very negative and not even be aware of it because you've isolated yourself from anything else.
A "yin-and-yang" way of saying it is that positive cannot exist without negative. I believe that is not just true in the world but in our thoughts as well.
I much prefer the word "critical" to "negative" when it comes to assessing the AmQuix opportunity. I am not negative about it, but I am extremely critical of it.
PW
"That was a really long way of saying the "negative" in the Q business is the lies to cover up the tool scam."
I suppose you would be right if that is what I was saying. However I don't seem to have this same obsession with something that has already been well-established. So I don't feel the need to write every single post about tool scams.
Drew,
Perhaps if you were a little more "obsessed" with the tool scam, you would see the point of calling non-IBO's "losers" is to create a false sense of loyalty with the lying cowardly "kingpins".
After all, who wants to be a "loser" or associated with "losers"?
Obviously, if the others are "losers", you must be a winner, or at least a "winner-in-training", and all you have to do is step right up and buy a brazillion tools to learn how to be a "winner", as all "winners" we know of found this to be the one and only path to success (being a "winner").
Again, it's called root cause analysis.
Once you find the root cause of an issue, you focus on it, and hammer it until it is fixed.
EVERYTHING else is a distraction, and can easily get you off-track.
OK Tex, you keep hammerin away then.
I agree, Drew! Knowing the negatives about ANY business can help you build a strong business, assuming you will NOT do the things that have made folks angry in the past!
It worked for my Spa Store - believe me, there's a bunch of slimeballs in THAT business, too.
And our immediate downline broke all of the "averages" set forth by Quixtar, because they WERE making some extra money; and we treated them like the valuable part of our business that they were. We "Edified Downline" - NOT the other way around.
Deb
Drew, thanks, I will.
I noticed you didn't have ANY response to my explanation how the "negative" topic is directly related to the root cause of the tool scam.
Even without tool money, IBOs will feel the urge to keep their downlines away from negatives. Only, there will be less money at stake.
The MLM model is such that it is very easy for rumors and wrong information to spread through the chains of downlines, unless the concerned MLM organization actively takes steps to deal with it. It also explains why people in an MLM organization should feel threatened by others' points of view.
Well Tex actually I did have a response but I was going to see if you could take my simple response as a hint. I guess I should have known better, so here is my response:
You might want to think about applying that "root cause analysis" to your 15 year 1000PV limitation problem. I bet if you find the root cause analysis of that issue and keep hammerin away at that you could finally pass up 1000PV before another 15 years pass.
Careful what you ask for in the future.
knverma, if what you are saying was true, then ALL MLM's should be shrinking, and I don't believe they are, as many are growing.
Drew, you still haven't responded to how I tied the "negative" issue to the tool scam, you resorted, as usual, to a personal attack. Still don't have a response, do you?
Geez Tex has your self-esteem gotten so low that you have resorted to fishing for responses from others?
I could give a crap what you tie the negative issue to. My post has nothing to do with what the negative issue is tied to, it gives the exact opposite advice of IBO leaders and states my explanation for how a little negative can actually be good for your business.
Everyone knows why IBO leaders don't want their IBOs looking at "negative", you have not uncovered some secret.
If you are so proud that you can make a connection that has been established for several years before anyone put it on the internet then go to a mirror and give yourself a pat on the back and bask in your own glory. Personally I wait till I actually accomplish something myself first, but I guess you have to start somewhere.
My response to you is not a personal attack, calling you an idiot would be a personal attack. But it is interesting that you see the reference to you being a 15 year 1000PV IBO as a personal attack. I just figured since you were big on root cause analysis you might want to apply that to your apparently struggling business.
Tex, "root cause analysis" requires clearer reasoning. How do my statements imply that all MLMs will shrink? Depending on the positive and negative factors, every MLM will grow from zero to a certain point before saturating of even shrinking.
For example, how did the well-known cult organizations grow or are growing, even when they encourage avoiding negatives?
Did I really misunderstand something in your post?
Drew,
The point is not "discovering" or "patting myself on the back", it is the FACT prospects are still becoming IBO's and getting ripped off on tool profits.
Many of them eventually go broke and/or find out about the tool scam, but by then the damage is done, and a new IBO starts the process all over again, hundreds every day.
Simply determining what the problem is and walking away is not the end of the task.
You have to make the problem so well known it creates CHANGE, like the changes going on in the UK DTI action.
I did apply the root cause analysis to my business, and came up with the lying cowardly "kingpin" tool scam.
knverma,
My point is if you are not lying about the tool scam, there is very little negative to be afraid of, and you can address the small remaining negative head-on without having to put a smiley face on everything.
I heard this before:
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
Hey Drew , I haven't been on here in a long time. What happened to the last person that ran this blog? I forget his name-sorry. Getting back to the tool business, I was wondering what all the hub-bub was about. Do only certain people make money from tools? I don't know how the whole system thing works and was wondering what all the hype was about?
Thanks,
Dex
Tex,
Sites like this one have made the tool scam so well known that change is starting to happen. If you think all the moves made by Quixtar have nothing to do with their net reputation then you are living in a fantasy land.
So you blame your upline for you not being able to sell a product or show a plan? I mean I can understand attributing a mounting debt, or other financial issues to the tool scam, but what does that have to do with you just doing the work?
Dex,
Eric is still around just not very active, but it is still his blog.
Every system is different but it is very obvious that certain upline pins make money from tool sales. I have yet to see an official document breaking down how tool money is paid out, but it is being paid out.
Drew,
You're a riot.
Read your message to Dex, and then your response to me, concerning tool profits, r..e..a..l s..l..o..w. Then tell me about how "everyone knows about the tool scam.
It may be time for another podcast, if you're up for some schooling, since it is summer break time. Name the day and time, student, the teacher is ready.
I never said the moves Q is making doesn't have something to do with their reputation, it has EVERYHING to do with it. What have you been smoking?
I don't blame my upline for not being able to sell a product (although it wasn't taught) or show the plan, and never said that, what is your point?
WOW Tex, you now are officially as dense as I have always believed you to be.
First off nowhere did I say "everyone" knew about the tool scam, remember read slowly Tex. Obviously there are those who still come to sites like this one and are shocked to find out that their upline makes money off of tools. But they do find out.
Now if Dex is for real, which I don't believe he/she is, then they obviously were not paying too much attention.
So now you are back to begging for another podcast. Are you having the shakes yet cause you need that boost to your ego. Well it will never happen again simply because people hate to hear you. They are the podcasts that get the least amount of hits by far, and I have had a ton of mail saying to never put you on again because as one fan wrote "I actually feel dumber having listened to Tex talk."
Apparently you are the one who needs to read real slow Tex cause you are way off the mark again. Who do you think caused Quixtar's net reputation? Sites like this one. Apparently we got through to a whole lot more people then you ever did, and we didn't even have to mindlessly repeat ourselves like you do.
So if the tool scam had nothing to do with you selling a product or showing a plan the apparently the root cause analysis of you being a 15 year 1000PV IBO has more to do with you then a tool scam. You just want to blame it on them since you don't want to admit it is your fault. So my point is that unless you can directly tie the tool scam to your inability to sell products the problem is you and you alone.
Drew,
Just as I thought, you're chicken to do another podcast.
This soap opera site is so disorganized, it would be a minor miracle for someone to get to the meaningful posts that describe the tool scam.
It's people like you that make it that way, Drew.
I never denied it was sites like this that got A/Q's attention, but I believe the sites, especially this one, could have done a faster/more effective job of getting to this point.
And remember, I was a part of this site and others that are part of the reason for A/Q taking action.
I do think the tool scam is partially to blame for me not having a retail business in the past, as this was never emphasized. In fact, I was taught by my upline how to trick the computer into thinking I did the required non-IBO retail volume.
I suppose you blame your failure with the business totally on yourself and not the tool scam, Drew? You must, because you had the same plan and retail opportunities I have, Drew.
"Just as I thought, you're chicken to do another podcast."
LOL! OK Tex, whatever you have to tell yourself. Apparently you don't understand that you have not given me any good reason to bring you back. There is nothing in it for me. The first time you were on I gave you the floor and you ran off at the mouth saying you "schooled" me, then the second time I asserted myself in normal fashion and you cried victim saying you didn't get to talk enough.
My listeners hate to hear you, no one cares what you have to say, so I have no reason to bring you back on. But like I said you tell yourself whatever you need to.
"This soap opera site is so disorganized, it would be a minor miracle for
someone to get to the meaningful posts that describe the tool scam."
Wait a minute, in the same comment you also say this:
"I never denied it was sites like this that got A/Q's attention"
WOW, I guess a miracle just took place then since we were able to get their attention with such disorganization. I do have this plan for position pages that I am going to run by Qblog though. I think it will be revolutionary for organization.....nah just kidding the idea sucks!
"It's people like you that make it that way, Drew."
So does this mean you are or aren't a fan of mine? LOL! I have to wonder why on earth you would beg to do a podcast with such a disorganized person in the first place? I think I will keep you on the Drew fan newsletter for a couple more weeks and let you think about it.
"I never denied it was sites like this that got A/Q's attention, but I
believe the sites, especially this one, could have done a faster/more
effective job of getting to this point."
Well one would think if you have all the answers you would have started your own site and showed us disorganized fools how to do it right. But instead you sit on the sidelines moaning and whining about why everyone should listen to you. Personally, I think we are getting close to that root cause analysis of why you are a 15 year 1000PV IBO.
"And remember, I was a part of this site and others that are part of the
reason for A/Q taking action."
Yes Tex you WERE a part of this site, but not really in a productive fashion. You were more like the disruptive village idiot. I mean you get banned from Insider's site, c'mon you get banned from the biggest propaganda site on the net.
"I do think the tool scam is partially to blame for me not having a retail
business in the past, as this was never emphasized. In fact, I was taught
by my upline how to trick the computer into thinking I did the required
non-IBO retail volume."
So which is it Tex? First you said you blame them, then you say you don't, now they are partially to blame. Let me know when you make up your mind. You still have not shown the link between the tool scam and your inability to sell products or recruit people.
"I suppose you blame your failure with the business totally on yourself and
not the tool scam, Drew? You must, because you had the same plan and retail
opportunities I have, Drew."
As I have said a million times, anything that happened to me in Quixtar was of my own doing. I made all the decisions and no one had a gun to my head. However, I don't absolve my upline and many of the leaders for some of their tactics and practices either.
The tools were the main reason I was in heavy debt when I left, and that's about it. It had nothing to do with retail or sponsoring. My wife was actually pretty good at retailing and we saw some success from XS and Artistry sales. Nothing to get excited about, but some sales were made.
So now Tex I am going to give you what I suspect you want from me so you can go whine on the internet. Which I guess means JoeCool's blog, since he seems to be the only one willing to let you post. Any comment from you made in the articles I write will be deleted since you have yet again proven you are beyond being civil when someone doesn't agree with you.
And there goes, Tex-the-genius.
Banned.
Again!
Who wants to bet that he'll now start posting his comments on here, that are rejected, on Joecool's blog? ;-D
For the record, on my blog, I can only delete comments - I don't have the power to ban anyone or their IP addresses. If I did, well, you know.....
No sweat Joe, I knew it was most likely something you couldn't do. No one lets Tex go totally crazy because they want to. But good thing PCJ is there. Even though the comments get tedious to read at times I do get great enjoyment out of watching PCJ school Tex on a regular basis.
It's like Tex just can't help himself, PCJ catches him on something in just about every other comment and as usual Tex has nothing intelligent to say in response. I have been enjoying the thread where PCJ has taken Tex's system and proven it to be 100% illegal. Tex is so dumbfounded I almost feel sorry for him....Almost.
"Finally, don't ignore or try to avoid negative."
Different people are at different stages of personal development. Each person has to decide for themself what tolerance they have towards negative critics. If one hasn't matured to the point you are suggesting that you are at, then I disagree with your statement above. If one must give up associating with negative people in order to achieve their goals, then I say do it. Do whatever it takes. At the same time continue to work on yourself until you can honestly say that negative people or comments don't impact you.
That was a really long way of saying the "negative" in the Q business is the lies to cover up the tool scam.
Posted by: Tex | May 27, 2007 1:36 PM