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July 26, 2006
In Their Own Words - 12
By Xanadustc in Their Own Words
Apparently logical questions are not allowed in TEAM if you are talking to Doug Stroh:
I can remember sitting down at a plan…I was just starting to feel really confident with my self and I had so much posture that the business was going to work, I was about 4000 PV or something and I showed this guy the plan and I got about three quarters of the way through it and he said, “Well, what is the price of the products?” I had the piece of paper on the table, I turned it over, slammed it down, and I said, “We don’t need to continue if you are going to base the business on the price of the products.”
Download Product Price [MP3] Doug Stroh, This is What I Do (SOL99)
The context is that his speech was about ‘posture’ which is defined in this business as how well you present your conviction that this business works. He concluded this remark by saying that he used to much posture in this case, yet he never went back to address the issue. This is a very common response to a direct and logical question with many system IBOs.
Comments
I hope the Wizard is kidding if he thinks price isn't important. The largest retailer in the world has built its empire on providing lower prices, always.
I would've kicked that moron out of my house if he's going to get confrontational over a simple and valid question. Did he ever answer?
I wonder why he didn't just give a straight answer?
Quixtar/Amway/Alticor pay attention
This is what your IBO's are being taught.
You can afford to have that kind of posture when you know your upline is buying your pin so they can get a bigger pin...
The great wizard is being sarcastic.
Ahhhh!
Another nightmare brought back.
Posture was one of the biggest things we were taught to do in INA. We were told to make it seem almost like an honor even to show someone the plan.
It always made me think of Tom Sawyer getting everyone to paint the fence for him.
Posture and learning how to change the subject to avoid questions. That's what we learned in Team Freedom.
“We don’t need to continue if you are going to base the business on the price of the products.”
It's comments like this that continue to make me laugh when IBOs say that because they're in Quixtar, they know more about business than I do.
What a coincidence! All during my time spent with TEAM, the various people from stage would proclaim how different TEAM was from those "other" groups. Everything was utterly different they'd say, thats why TEAM is growing so fast.
I thought the whole "posture" thing was unique to TEAM. In retrospect, I find it funny to hear people from other organizations talk about it too.
I guess everyone, regardless of LOS, ends up in the same POSTURE in the end: Bent over by the Kingpins!!!
Nope, it wasn't just Team. "Posture" was taught very strongly in BWW as one of the really important things when prospecting. And my exposure to WWDB CDs shows that they teach the same things.
I can understand the need for posture. As we understood, it was more of a confidence in what you are doing. I try to impress on my sales reps to have that kind of posture or confidence when they sell. I don't mind if they even walk away from a potential customer if that customer is trying to play games with them. Mostly, because I don't want them wasting the time that I'm paying for.
The difference really is in that my company offers genuine value in better service and prices. The type of "posture" that the Quixtar leaders advocate has more to do with manipulating a prospect into not asking for what I believe to be vital business information about the Quixtar business.
From the Quixtar leaders perspective, what else are they going to do? If they show the prospect the prices, chances are likely that their prospect won't join. Why change the prices to be more competetive when manipulation has worked so well in the past?
We were made to believe that Billy Florence invented the whole posture idea! Also in the same speech would be a reminder of the evils of crossline communication...
Since I've never been in Amway, and have had only a few sales jobs in my life, I'd never heard of sales "posture." It seemed like a poor choice of terminology, until I carefully checked the definition. Posture: "to assume an artificial or pretended attitude" and more telling--"a conscious mental pose (as of moral superiority.)"
I get it now. To demonstrate "posture," you act like a poser.
I'm not surprised you had to *carefully* check the dictionary definition,truebeliever. I had to check *carefully* too to find the definitions you gave. But once I ignored things like -
* A stance or disposition with regard to something
* A frame of mind affecting one's thoughts or behavior; an overall attitude.
* a conscious mental or outward behavioral attitude
But, ignoring those, and some others, I did indeed find the definitions you chose to highlight
(source: www.dictionary.com)
Ah, you are always there to keep me grounded and completely informed, aren't you, insider? I can't toss out my smart aleck asides and get away with them whenever you're on duty. I am tempted to call you (as per Stephen Colbert)"my formidable opponent."
Posture? It's still all about attitude, however you define it, and you have to admit slamming papers down so dramatically and challenging, perhaps antagonizing a prospect instead of persuading him is more about style (and ego) than substance.
Good day, sir! (Now I'm posturing..)
insider,
I don't know what Network21 teaches, but the definitions you gave are not what is taught in BWW, WWDB and apparently Team. Posture means always acting like you have the upper hand and you don't need the prospect. For example, when setting up an appointment with a prospect, you are supposed act like you are really busy and the business is taking off (whether that is true or not) and kind of make the prospect feel like they are privileged to even have some of your time.
Insider:
Here is another word for your dictionary:
disingenuous |ˌdisinˈjenyoōəs| adjective
Not candid or sincere, typically by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does.
That sounds suspiciously like what you are trying to do.
In BWW, posture is talked about at "training" sessions all the time. It is nothing more than "fake it till you make it". Yet more deceptions from the A/QMOs. Unfortunately, this is not unique to TEAM, as others have pointed out.
It's funny, but my former upline Emerald did almost the same thing as Doug Stroh. He got a direct question about cost versus income, threw down his pad and pen and told the prospect the plan was over. Way to go dude. He should have read more "People Skills" books. LOL.
insider: |n-sdr|
Officially, an officer, a director, or the owner of 10% or more of a firm's securities.
Do we fools have the gall to question this obvious powerful man?? He could squash us all with but a flick of his golden Quixtar branded pen!
We should turn our heads from his Glistar polished grimace of power and quake in self pity, for this man KNOWS about things he is the INSIDER!
Unless of course he is only the other definition:
"An excepted member of a group."
Then I wouldn't bother to listen to a word he babbles, cause there are lots of those crazies!
(POOF) The Quix has left the building!
ahh, stirring up you guys is rapidly becoming my #1 hobby ....
it's just soo much fun ... heh heh heh
So insider just admitted he's a troll?
if pointing out facts that are inconvenient for you amounts to trolling, well, you have a new definition of the word then!
no, this:
"ahh, stirring up you guys is rapidly becoming my #1 hobby ....
it's just soo much fun ... heh heh heh"
amounts to trolling
DUH
yeah, ok, that post could be considered trolling :)
This post is completely demonstrative of how far behind the 8-ball you guys really are regarding this business. X, this is the third post where you have critiqued a recording that is over three years old.
If this is to be a blog with objective information regarding the business, it’s time you guys got with the times and offered some timely information. I have yet to read any posts about Billy Florence’s team joining with The Team led by Woodward. That’s old news (along with Casey Combdan sp? joining). It’s obvious that other groups are wanting to take part in the explosive success The Team is having right now. I have yet to read any posts about how The Team’s overall volume has doubled in the past five months due to a move by Brady and Woodward known as D.O.T. 1 S.T.E.P. Although it sounds crazy, it’s true. I can personally attest to this as my personal volume has more than doubled in five months from 4000 PV to 9100 PV in platinum qualification. I’m sorry, but I just had to spare you the three year wait before you found out about all this and “analyze” it with your expert perceptions. Now the Team leads with the XS products and Trim Advantage bars. The two brands are high in quality, competitively priced, and fill a market niche for sports nutrition products. I’ll let you figure out the details behind the program and why it’s been so successful. Now that Orrin's teamed up with other groups, the business will only keep getting better. What about the fact that Woodward and Brady are giving all the proceeds from their book “Launching a Leadership Revolution” to charity once it gets released mainstream by Time Warner. Not bad for some greedy, evil, money hungry “kingpins.” What do you think about those guys building churches in India. Not too bad, huh? Get one of Pastor Dickie's most recent tapes and he'll tell you about the ground breakings.
You guys claim to offer objective information about the business, yet you critique single phrases from recordings done years ago and wear it out. Let’s be honest, X, this blog is nothing more than a gathering place where failures in the business go to legitimize their losses. An association like this is inevitable. You're like Agent Smith in the Matrix. The Team is exploding, in spite of your “objective” dissemination of information. This is where you say, “but, but, but,…..they’re making money on those CDs” No kidding! How much bang for your buck do you get with cable TV? You spend over $1,200 a year (on average) and you’re no better off because of it. Of course this doesn’t apply to you, X, because as you put it, you are too busy accomplishing too much in a day to waste your time. The Team system has far more value than cable television, and other organizations are starting to get on board. I understand you have some Pastor Dickie tapes. Those tapes are phenomenal and I highly encourage you to listen to them. He is a phenomenal man with a passion for helping people.
Please stay abreast of all the changes. It’s painful to watch you guys fumble around in the dark.
Ps, don’t bother criticizing my grammar or asking ridiculous questions. This is my first and last post.
I guess that makes craig and insider trolls.
I appreciate what X does with his analysis of tapes. The tapes some tapes may be three years old, but relatively speaking, that's not that old. They fall into that time span wherein a person could go diamond (3-5 years).
Also, I think that quixtar's mo's need to take reponsibility for what is on the tapes/CDs. They only thing that X is doing is stating his interpretation of the message. I've heard some of the tapes, not the exact ones X refers to, but others from BWW. I did not agree with the Scriptural content or the speaker's view of money. When I discussed this with my IBO inlaws who said that that was not the view of the company or even their own opinion, I questioned why then does BWW support this message by SELLING the tape? Of course, I was being too negative. It was then that I realized I could not support quixtar.
Another analogy of how I feel is this. When my daughter was interested in joining girl scouts, I thought I'd do some investigating. The general public image of GS is that they help build leaders, it's fun and educational, so what the heck. After doing some research, I discovered a liberal, pro-choice, pro-homosexual agenda. I was appalled (and yes, naive)and contacted local leaders to see their reaction. To my suprise, they claimed that GS do not support such beliefs; (even though, at the national level, they gave their highest honor to a scout for her gay-lesbian empowerment group she developed) they remain "neutral," and none of that type of activity was going on in the local chapters. So, in essence, they never owned up to what their actions, or the actions that their organization supported, illustrated. I could not support a group that didn't have the guts to take a stance as to what they support and believe.
Quixtar may have some great products, and I have no doubt that people are making money at selling it. Many times quixtar folks try to justify the company by showing how people are supporting charities with their profits, kind of an "ends-justifies-the-means" take. But, from my standpoint, I cannot support this company because of its wishywashy and manipulative view of Scripture, no matter how explosive or phenominal their growth of sales currently are, or soon will be.
Shouldn't everyone have recognized insider as a troll a long time ago? Anybody who was as badly indoctrinated as he appears would have run away from this site a long time ago because of how "negative" it is =).
Craig's post makes me laugh. I guess the people who used those techniques three years ago were morons for using them back then...it's funny though that XS energy drinks were the same flagship product three years ago. If you're not making new mainstream products, cutting prices, or doing any of the other things that a business in the real world does, then what ARE you doing?
Oh, I forgot. You're engaging in more groupthink to stay core while "The Business" is increasingly outsourced to India, where there are more people without internet access who can't read this blog.
How much bang for your buck do you get with cable TV? You spend over $1,200 a year.
Actually, I pay only $100.00 for the basic, basic package--not a lot of fancy stuff. What do I get? News--you need to have a discerning ear. Fox new is great. Weather- my family loves the weather channel. Family entertainment. If you have common sense, you can find things the whole family can enjoy and discuss and help my kids' critical thinking skills.
The Team system has far more value than cable television...
Why in the world are you comparing quixtar tools to cable television?? I'm not watching TV to make money or to help my self esteem.
...and other organizations are starting to get on board.
Just out of curiosity, what organizations are you refering to?
It’s painful to watch you guys fumble around in the dark.
I know.
Hi Guys, please answer these questions.
1. What profession are you ? Are you successful at what you do ? Can your income compare any close to any of the Diamonds ? Or Robert Kiyosaki is stupid for saying that Network Marketing is the way to go? Or Warren Buffet is stupid of buying Pampered Chef ? or Paul Zane Pilzer is stupid for writing the book Next Trillion. Or John Maxwell is stupid by being good friend of Ron Puryear and WWDB ?
Guys, quit fooling yourself. If you didn't have guts to make it (in any business, not Only Quixtar), please keep your low SELF IMAGE or Inferiority Complex to yourself. You may be ok, but critisizing on Inet is a perfect prove that you have these problems.
I came down to your level, to lift you up a bit.
Aidar Omarov> Hi Guys, please answer these questions.
1. What profession are you ? Are you successful at what you do ? Can your income compare any close to any of the Diamonds
Sure, as soon as you prove what the diamond's income is. How else can we compare? In the book by Ruth Carter, the diamond earned 3 million a year but had amway/quixtar business expenses of 3.1 million.
Therefore, if I was unemployed and
did nothing, I was better off than that diamond!
1. What profession are you ? educator
2. Are you successful at what you do ? yes
3. Can your income compare any close to any of the Diamonds ? probably not. I'm not sure what that income level is, but it is portrayed as quite high.
If you didn't have guts to make it (in any business, not Only Quixtar), please keep your low SELF IMAGE or Inferiority Complex to yourselves.
I don't want a business. Just because people are critical of Quixtar does not make them victims of low self esteem or inferiority complexes. Sometimes people just want to share information to help others make an informed decision or to see another side of a picture. But that is just my spin on things. I am not trying to change your mind because I realize that that is highly unlikely.
Aidar,
To answer your questions:
"1. What profession are you?"
-Business Owner.
"Are you successful at what you do?"
-I'd like to think so.
"Can your income compare any close to any of the Diamonds?"
-Is that before or after tape, seminar, and function money? Also, what do they make after expenses?
"Or Robert Kiyosaki is stupid for saying that Network Marketing is the way to go?"
-What was the exact quote? Why then is he not a Quixtar Diamond? Why did he choose to make his money in real estate and his Rich Dad/Poor Dad series? Quixtar IBO's are famous for parroting what their upline has told them as opposed to reading it for themselves. (Example- "Bill Gates said on Oprah that Quixtar is going to be huge." :)
"Or Warren Buffet is stupid of buying Pampered Chef?"
-Notice he bought Pampered Chef. He didn't become a distributor. Also, Pampered Chef has a business model that seems to work along with products people are willing to pay for. At least my wife seems to like them. The only thing my wife liked through Quixtar was the plastic wrap.
"or Paul Zane Pilzer is stupid for writing the book Next Trillion."
-I've heard him speak. He believes that people can become wealthy by teaching people about products or services that they didn't even know exist. That's what Pampered Chef does. Your business, Quixtar struggles with that. That would mean selling. All the Quixfolk cheer wildly when he speaks, but very few actually listen to what he is saying.
"Or John Maxwell is stupid by being good friend of Ron Puryear and WWDB?"
-That's just a silly question. I really don't give a rat's ace who either are friends with. Should I be concerned that the two are friends?
Doug just went diamond this month. TEAMS volume went up (over 20)millions of points in 4-6 months.
Hi Good people
Hi Good people
How dare you...how dare you Sir question the price?? Of all things you concern yourself with you had to go and worry about money. It makes me sick!
(Sigh) Can't you see Quix isn't about the cost of things. Its about people. Its about people helping people.
Its about the oportunity to be a part of teaching others to not worry about the cost of our products.
Sir, if you can't see past the the cost of products how can you ever hope to get others see past it?
I think this conversation is over...unless you would like a case of XS to take home to the kids?
Posted by: Wizard of Quix | July 26, 2006 10:08 PM