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May 9, 2006
Ashamed of Quixtar?
By Xanadustc in A/QMOs
As I have mentioned on a recent post on the Standing Order Tape blog, Quixtar rules prevent an IBO from using the Quixtar name on a business website or other large-scale media that is open to the public. But I question whether many IBOs are becoming ashamed of the name Quixtar as they did the name Amway. Rich DeVos spoke to this issue on the Directly Speaking tape:
Number Seven: I will not hide behind group names.
We are proud of our group and like our own identity, but we will not use it as a subterfuge to say we are not in Amway. This really is a hot one, folks. People are saying, "Oh, we're in X-Y-Z organization. We're not in Amway." If you are signed on an Amway application form and if you have anyone you sponsor who's linked to you, then you are in Amway. I don't care what other name you want to run under: By implication, you are saying you're not in Amway: If you are asked, then you must say, "I am in Amway." And if you're not willing to say that, then don't send me any letters.
In fact, much of the Britt World Wide (BWW) team calls BWW their main business. Even still, many tapes on contacting still use the curiosity approach despite what Rich had to say about that approach (MP3).
For a modern example of this Quixtar “hide and seek," I found a BWW PDF file with details about how to remove all Quixtar references from the BWW One Domain IBO website.
Are they ashamed to be in Quixtar?
Comments
Fitz,
While the contacting and "deer in the headlights" look is common, and WRONG, having "Quixtar" on your business card is not very common because it requires annual permission from the corporation and a lot of scrutiny. The details can be found in the rules compendium.
Thanks for the comment, though, that is EXACTLY what I am talking about...the IBO's are ashamed of Quixtar because once you bring it up, the prospect will run to the internet and type in 'Quixtar', or 'Quickstar', and usually find sites like this.
I'm in Quixtar! =)
Based on my interactions with the kingpins it is less about being ashamed and more about wanting to create distance between “their” group and the corporation. I believe that what was revealed in Amway’s 1983 internal memo known as the Postma Memo applies even more so today.
It is spelled out very plainly in the following excerpt of the Memo:
"Relationship with the corporation. For most new distributors, the corporation is a complete enigma. Although they have signed an application with the corporation contractually agreeing to abide by certain principals, the line of sponsorship does not allow communication between the distributor and the corporation. Since his source of information is consistently upline, there becomes no necessity for the individual to develop that relationship. Historically, this line of sponsorship has viewed the corporation as an impediment to their growth. Because of the fiercely independent nature of its distributors, Directs, and Diamonds, the corporation has become viewed as a hindrance. There is insecurity about the way that the corporation deals with any challenges in the distributor organization. First of all, this organization does not feel that the company can understand the impact of building the business on a person. It is their feeling that no one at the company completely relates to their efforts in attempting to build the business and organization. This includes even Rich and Jay. It is their feeling that Rich and Jay do not have an understanding of what it takes to build the Amway business today. Second, this organization feels insecure about the direction the corporation is taking. There is a constant feeling of competition with the corporation. In addition, this organization, because of its structure method of doing business, looks at the corporation as a rudderless ship. Every time that the company comes out with a change in direction, they feel that this is confusing their new distributors. As a result, they discourage their distributors from being involved in any corporation function or tape program. In addition, the corporation serves to signal other success in other lines of sponsorship. This system does no allow that success can be built differently than in the method that they use...
...In the words of one Diamond from the Northwest, "The corporation should manufacture products and get out of the way." This sums up the extent of the relationship that these Diamonds wish to have with the company. Although this is an extreme point of view for many of these distributors, this view is often times heard as they honestly believe that the corporation is in no way motivating. It has been my judgment on observations, that they do no do a better meeting than we do, nor can they provide the same type of motivation as we do. However, in attempting to convince the corporation to stay out of the motivation business, it allows them to do two things: first, it further isolates the business, second, it allows them to operate a motivation business with little or no competition. Another factor involved is that in some cases, people are trained to do the business in an improper manner. Having a corporation representative stop a Direct from doing certain practices causes confusion in their organizations and a breakdown in the trust relationship that has been developed..."
well, it wouldn't be because of sites like this and amquix spreading disinformation would it?
Having said that, I think it would be better for people to take some short term pain and get out there and be proud of the name and the association. Create positive brand image to counter the negative image promoted on sites like this.
Insider>well, it wouldn't be because of sites like this and amquix spreading disinformation would it?
X> No, DeVos addressed the problem long before these sites were out, the problem was the conduct of the IBO's.
Insider>I think it would be better for people to take some short term pain and get out there and be proud of the name and the association.
X> Amen to that. If you are ashamed of the name, don't sign up! If it is truely that good, don't dance around about it, just be honest and do what DeVos suggests: Ask if they would be interested in the Amway (Quixtar) plan. If so, show it honestly, if not, say thank you for your time. If they see it an and say no thank you, then you can say, "Thanks for the time".
Insider>Create positive brand image to counter the negative image promoted on sites like this.
X>This site is not "negative", it is clearly making public the information that many of the IBO's are not telling people during the recruitment process.
Good stuff insider, it's all because of sites like this that IBOs are ashamed of Quixtar. It has nothing to do with Quixtar or behaviour of IBOs.
Btw, If the "false" information was not relatable to experience of majority reading this site, no onw would be reading it.
IMO Quixtar is responcible for all this negativity. And apparently they're not doing anything to fix it. Other than .... you know, you :D
http://tinyurl.com/g35oa
Btw say hi to BO. He was a Diamond and he was on Dateline show as well. And he's very gentle with goats.
well, it wouldn't be because of sites like this and amquix spreading disinformation would it?
Have you ever met other people who are dance around when asked the name of the company they work for, at say places like Wal-Mart or Proctor & Gamble? They both get negative attention on the web. Or is that only to be used when it's convenient for pro-quixtar folk?
That and people who totally rely on information from internet blogs and websites probably shouldn't be involved with a "business opportunity" to begin with. Or at least I wouldn't want them working with me.
We've heard it all. Quixtar is not amway. What do you mean by quixtar?
It's not quixtar's fault.
Sorry, but when all these millions of IBO's running around doing crazy things, then the reputation takes a dive.
Some IBO's do run things correctly, but that's in spite of the rest who do not.
The bad reputation has already saturated most of the US.
insider> well, it wouldn't be because of sites like this and amquix spreading disinformation would it?
DI> Of course! Heaven forbid the company's negative brand image is actually a result of actions taken by the company and it's distributors! Naaah, that's impossible! ::roll eyes::
BTW, somehow I doubt amquix existed in the '80s...A quick Google search would reveal that Al Gore had not invented the World Wide Web yet!
I've got the Quixtar logo on my business cards- and it says Independant distributor- powered by Quixtar. Nothing being "hidden" here.
You can order the nicer Quixtar business cards through the printshop partner store, that are quixtar approved.
Michael, good for you. Your response is factual and right on the money.
See, IBO or prospect can see for themselves if they know a lot more IBO that behaves like Michael, or like x's post. If virtually all IBOs are like Michael, then naturally website like this will loose its credibility.
I mean, do NASA has to worry about flat-earth society?!?
Of course it ultimately tracks back to IBO behaviour, but much of the criticism one reads doesn't refer to individual IBOs doing the wrong thing. I'm in a long and ridiculous discussion now about it being a Ponzi scheme. Others took about systems scams, but talk about "the system" or "Quixtar" without references to which system of even individuals within systems. If you have individuals within an organisation behaving badly, criticising the whole organisation without discrimination is not a good way to promote change.
Keep spinning it insider.
In 1980's neither this blog or amquix.info exists, yet there was a huge image problem alongwith many other problems. And Rich Devos had to release "Directly Speaking" and talk about all the bad practices.
My question is, you do agree there are some bad practices in some organizations? How would a prospect know under which IBO to sign up? My upline is much smooth talker than you, most sincere looking and turn out a complete fraud.
I think these sites help to highlight the signs of bad practices and help prospect determine if the organization they want to join is one of those or not.
Insider,
Actually the organization DOES bear partial, if not most of the responsibility in this situation.
Case in point: Note the similarity of reports on the internet by people who were prospected. No matter which part of the country it is, those who were prospected by IBOs from organizations such as BWW, WWDB and TEAM, report that very similar techniques were used on them to get them to express interest, come to a meeting, or sign up as an IBO.
Strange, huh? So many IBOs, yet all using similar techniques. Combine that with the emphasis on "duplication" and following the system and it becomes obvious: these IBOs do not use these techniques because they have malicious intent nor did they develop these techniques on their own; they use them because they were taught to do so by the system tools!
In a "business" that places so much emphasis on following the system to a 'T', only so much blame can be placed on the lowly IBO who's trying to make his 100 monthly PV. Those who teach him the deceptive techniques and emphasize how important it is to use them bear the ultimate responsibility.
I'll give Insider this. I haven't heard much about N21.
I've experienced and heard much about deceptive practices from WWDB and BWW.
And because many downline listen to tapes and follow (duplicate) what is taught, you have an army of people deceiving others, although the downline may not realize it.
I’m in Quixtar according you guys but what's funny is corporate America does the same thing all the time. I stay in Raleigh,Nc and I worked for a company called prime communications okay now here is what's funny they had a cingular wireless franchise sign up because they sold cingular wireless services. All the checks came from prime communications to my name but never mentioned cingular wireless. My business is registered and the checks come in my business name I have a bank account in my business name.quixtar is the company sending the check but they do not build my team, order my products or anything. They don't even store or inventory the products.alticor corporation is the warehouse and send the products. How many state farm agents are using the state farm name and sell the insurance but have sanders insurance company on the card or on the sign or even in the phone book. You have to call or go to the office to find out what brand of insurance they sale. Perfect example. Drive insurance. They sell progressive,gmac,and some other brand of insurance. They list the phonebook directory, the commercials, and all advertisements as drive insurance not progressive or gmac.that is all I do. I give a card with my legal business name in which I am registered and the checks or paid and mailed to. It is not being ashamed of quixtar but they are the support company. My business is not named quixtar.it is supported by quixtar.if your going to call out quixtar call out all companies who are listed under legal business names rather then the supply companies name.atack all these insurance offices who have the company name instead of the insurance providers name. do you make it your life to try and bring down people with good intentions cause you never made it? Are one of the people who joined the business did it for 3 weeks and because you didn't make a million your saying it's a scam and making blogs and pages against it. How many people went to college for design or communications but now work in sales or marketing or some job that has nothing to do with the degree they got do you have or are you going make a blog trying to bring down those graduates and the degree they worked hard to receive or maybe even all the colleges and universities in the world for giving them the opportunity to get that degree knowing the low chances of working in that field. that’s what your doing to quixtar.we give them a chance to make some extra money and build a business of their own that they take pride in and do the work in and they get paid for based on their work. Just be honest. You can't say it doesn't work it does. Every year someone goes diamond every year someone get's in the business and in 3 months is making $400 or $500 extra dollars on top of their job check. You can't say it doesn't work. It took my wife and I 6 months to go platinum and 18 months to go emerald and by this time next year we will be diamonds. That is within less then 3 years. We have only been in the business a year and 8 months. Not even 2 years and we have already started making an extra $2200 average since January of this year not to mention last years earnings. You make it your life to steal others dreams about quixtar saying the people at the top get all the money it's a scam but yet the Walton’s get all the money made by wal-mart and the Sam’s club and I bet you still shop there. Do you have a blog against every corporate job in the world. Any owner of and major corporation gets all the money while some guy at the bottom gets $10,000 or $20,000 a year to make it for them.Mcdonalds,microsoft,walmart,sams club,target,burger king,wendys,any place you work or know someone that works at has the same business plan we do. Even if you own your own business. If your a roofer you don't split the check for the jobs even with all employees you get a most of the money and the rest get a hourly wage. What makes quixtar so bad.what about the lawsuits is that your ammo. Name one major company that has not or doesn't have now a lawsuit against them. Okay the success rate. Look at the lay offs and turn over rates at any major corporation in the world. Everyday someone gets fired,quits,or gets laid off. What is the difference between someone who quits quixtar and bad mouths it and quits McDonalds and bad mouths it. There is nothing that quixtar does or says that is different than anything major corporate companies do or say. What are the chances of me and my wife both working were you work at and in 3 years being able to get 5 all expense paid trips to 3 different states and 1 country outside of the usa.what are the chances that if we work hard at the end of the year we get an extra $10,000 bonus for our hard work and for staying an employee for 12 out of 12 months.quixtar gave it to us. They paid for our 5 trips including the hotels, plane tickets,food,free tickets for a show, spending money and the limo's when we went to shop or get some food. Would your company let us sleep till 10am and then nap at anytime we want and just show up and work anytime we want but still pay us $2200 a month. Will they give us a raise every time someone new gets hired. What about if some hits supervisor will we get a 4% bonus every month based on the money he is making the company and get that bonus for every employee that does that we know or referred to the company. Can we take 4 hour lunch breaks to play golf with fiends and still get paid. Can we use the company name and expenses at tax time so we get the same tax breaks they get. Can we make more money the owner of the company because we worked harder the first 3 months we worked there. Most of all can we take our 2 kids to the work place and just sit around and play with them and have fun with them everyday and still get paid.quixtar lets us do all of that and they provide all of that. No one that works for Wal-Mart will ever be a part time cashier and make more money than one of the waltons.my wife and I are emeralds in the business and our sponsors are not even platinum’s yet. We passed them. You will never make more money then your manager with out having his job or getting the job above him. Our upline is always our upline and our sponsors. They will never be our downline and we will never be their sponsors. You will never make more than the owner of your company unless he dies, gets fired or sells the company to you or you become owner somehow. You never make more money than him and him be the owner and you be a part time bag boy or cashier. Why is quixtar so bad. Tell me how you can do anything at your job or any job I just described we do with quixtar.oh yeah and don’t use a company paid trip from Texas to new York to do business as an all expense paid trip. We did no work we went to eat,shop,and play with our kids at the beach. We didn't prospect, show plans, or attend any meetings or business related activities. Just my 4 family members and a paid tab. Tell me a company that can match all that. If your going to talk about scams don't single out quixtar.name every job,college,university and company in the world. All make money none promise you will. Name one college that guaranties when you graduate they will give you job in that field and a guaranteed salary that grows with all people you refer or hire along with the chance in 5 years to still get paid even if you quit the job, and that can guaranty you will make enough money to have all of your dreams come true and give a life to your children and family members not born for another 50 years the same. And most of all can they guaranty that the job they get will be giving and passed down when they die from generation to generation with and increasing pay and full ownership of all money and properties affiliated with what they earned. If you can do please do cause I would love to know the truth about quixtar.
Wow Mr. Emerald,
That was quite a rant! Could you please type it in proper sentance structure so that I can read it?
Let me try to respond to a few points I saw.
First, you say you went Platinum in 6 months. Did you get in and go 7500 in the first month and maintain it for 6 straight months, getting in at the middle of the fiscal year, or are you embellishing your acomplishment and mean to say 'Silver'. It takes 6 months in a fiscal year to be a 'Platinum'.
Next, you ask if I am a person who spend 3 weeks and it didn't work. Why don't you read my story. You will find it on my site. Just click my username at the bottom of this comment and use the sidebar to go to my experience. While you are there, why don't you look at what Quixtar is doing to you Spiritually?
It seems you are confusing companies having divisions and suppliers vs. trying to hide the name Quixtar. And again, if you read my post at the top, it is a theory based on long standing evidence. Have you listened to Directly Speaking? If not, I encourage you to.
Other than those comments, I am not sifting through your mess to try to find more things to say. Write it a little closer to proper and I will have a look at it then.
xanadustc..It's spelled SENTENCE...jajaja...You must be pretty old if your already talking about long theory of evidence.Things change and so do business'. i am sure you weren't this grumpy when you first looked into quixtar, right?..LOL..Cuz if you say you were in it you must know how it works, cuz there is theory behind it, yes?
Even if Mr. Emerald didn't get to platinum in 6 months he is still making it and has a better lifestyle than you? He atleast has a plan for his family to secure a future, whats your plan, burger joint or working for an employer or even working for your self. He is probably at the beach or traveling with his family while you're at home all upset cuz you didn't make it in that kind of structured business. You can't make your bad experiences everyone elses, it doesn't work that way. I am betting that if you had a million dollars in your name you would keep it and waste it on yourself rather than think of others and what you could help them in. That is the difference between you (probably selfish with rage)and others trying to make a difference, not just in their lives but other families aswell. Go ahead, ask yourself, where would you go or do with a lifestyle that allows you to have the time and money? Oh yeah don't forget don't be selfish.jajajajaja
I was around one of my friends when he was prospected, and I was overhearing what was going on I knew immediately what it was. I asked the IBO if he was in Quixtar and he gave me the deer in headlights look followed by a "Yeah, but..", as if I'd discovered some dirty little secret. I've seen a few business cards of IBO's and not a single one mentioned Quixtar, or even gave a hint about what the "business" was about.
Posted by: Fitz | May 9, 2006 4:00 PM