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July 16, 2005
FYI
By QBlog in Blog News
If the foundation of your business is built on information control then your business will fail. Information cannot be controlled. With the Internet and improved global communications that control has evaporated.
If the thought of a world where you can't control the flow of information (positive, negative, neutral) about your business scares you then you're in the wrong business. Get out while you still can.
If you consider those who freely share information about your business to be your enemies then you'll quickly discover that you're in the midst of a civil war.
If your business is hesitant to share raw, audited data about its performance then chances are that it's hiding information it would rather you didn't know.
Comments
Great post!
One of the reasons we left the business was the glaring fact, which we often ignored, that we always had to defend it. In retrospect (and in reading many of the pro-Quixtar posts on this blog & other sites), I am amazed that I, and many others, never really stopped to THINK about what I was defending and how I had to do it. My involvement in perpetuating this business is truly among 'my most embarrassing moments'.
Ispent this week with some family members who are IBO's with BWW. They had never heard of the 30/70% rule, that with BWW, you only need to sell 50 pv to client/members to get a bonus check. Is this true? I thought 30/70 was a hard and fast rule that kept A/Q from being a pyramid scheme.
Also, is it true that Bill and Peggy Britt are legally separated? After listening to atape of them talking about their strong marriage, I wasn't sure if they were telling the truth. My mother-in-law had heard nothing of this separation.
So what's the truth?
I just want to add that I'm NOT trying to spread rumors about Peggy and Bill Britt, or Bill's financial endeavors. I simply want the truth to be told, since they talk about how strong marriage their marriage is, partly due to the business. Can someone offer me proof?
Hey inquiring mind,
Go to amquix's site and go to the "The Hall of Shame " section. All the proof that you will need is there. 911 transcripts, Bill's investment scams, his affair with another lady they even have pictures.
I love the internet!
Here is the page.
http://www.amquix.info/britt_separation.html
Ha! hi Phyliss Frankel :) How was Billy btw?
Here are the two relevant sections from the Quixtar business reference guide in response to inquiringmind's comments about the 70% rule
4.18. Seventy Percent Rule: An IBO must sell
at least 70% of the total amount of products purchased during a given month in order to receive the Performance Bonus or recognition due on all the products purchased; if the IBO fails to sell at least 70%, then such IBO may be paid that percentage of Performance Bonus measured by the amount of products actually sold, rather than the amount of products purchased, and recognized accordingly.
4.18.1. Performance Bonuses are intended to
be earned on sales volume. However, since the Business Volume during a particular month will, under normal circumstances, approximately equal the sales volume, or retail value, of the products an IBO sells during that month, and since it is cumbersome to administer the payment
of Performance Bonuses on the basis
of products actually sold (which would involve
knowing the product inventory of every IBO), the payment of Performance Bonuses is for convenience based on monthly Business Volume rather than on a monthly sales volume.
4.19. Reserved
4.20. Reserved
4.21. Reserved
4.22. Member/Client Volume: In order to obtain the right to earn a Performance Bonus on downline volume during a given month, an IBO must:
(a) make not less than one sale to each of 10 different retail customers (e.g., Members or Clients); or (b) have at least 50 PV of sales to any number of retail customers; or (c) have $100 at Member/Client Volume Cost. Member/Client Volume Rule Cost shall mean the published IBO cost for all items or any orders sold to a Member or Client, or the
actual price paid to Partner Stores by Members or Clients. If applicable, Partner Store Member/Client Volume Rule Cost is applied in the month when the Corporation credits Partner Store Volume to an IBO’s business.
4.22.1. In producing proof of such sales, the IBO should not disclose the prices at which he or she made the Member/Client sales.
4.22.2. If such an IBO fails in any month to make said Member/Client sales and/or to produce proof of making such sales, then he or she may not retain or will be denied his or her Performance Bonus that month on downline volume. It is the obligation of the IBO to self-report as appropriate with their method of reporting, by the official deadlines published by the Corporation, in order to qualify for his or her Performance Bonus on
downline volume. This Rule shall apply unless the IBO is a currently qualified Platinum or above.
This is what I have been saying all along...
I have, somewhere, a Gooch "Internet" (now ProAlliance, I think) tape where Tim Foley (EDC now?) states that "this Business is built on progressive disclosure". The gist of this was basically that, "for their own good", people should be given the absolute minimum amount of information that it took to get them into and keep them in the business, regardless of what they asked or how they asked for it. This theme was echoed by a number other Diamonds as well.
This is, to me, one of the hallmarks of fraud and is why I am philosophically opposed to the "networking" business.
Think about it - your own grandmother probably said it best when she told that people that talk like their hiding something typcially are.
Mike
From what I know about this pyramid stuff it seems like people who get involved are given all the information before they sign up anyway, it's just not all given the first time they hear about it... doesn't sound much like fraud to me.
Laith,
You must not be too familiar with them. I have been to several MLM presentations and NONE of them were upfront with things.
I agree with you Laith - I didn't get every detail the first time I sat down, but I asked questions and I got straight answers - and got more and more info each time.
Some of these critics like to paint the picture that everything is a scam - and that everyone involved is a liar and cult leader. They spread this BS to discredit us, because they truly believe in what they say - but unfortunately they don't have all the facts. I don't doubt that some of them may have been misled - but I was not! and they don't acknowledge it - just that I "must be brainwashed!"
Tony>Some of these critics like to paint the picture that everything is a scam - and that everyone involved is a liar and cult leader. They spread this BS to discredit us, because they truly believe in what they say - but unfortunately they don't have all the facts. I don't doubt that some of them may have been misled - but I was not! and they don't acknowledge it - just that I "must be brainwashed!"
TD>Tony, the point that you always miss is that many of us critics said the exact same thing, "I'm not misled, I know the facts" when we were building the business and confronted with negative folks. I thought my upline were upstanding folks, just like you do. I justified the reasons they wanted us plugged into the (optional!) system, just like you do. What I keep trying to get across to you is that I did not have a "bad upline" or LOS, I had a NORMAL one. If they were so bad, why would we have stayed for 11 years?
I don't spread this stuff to discredit you. I tell my story and warn people about this business because I want to try and prevent others from going through the same hell I did. It has nothing to do with you or any other IBO.
What HELL did you go thru TD - that someone made money off your $7 CD??? Who the hell cares! If you thought the CD was of value and worth $7.50 then buy it!! If not, then Don't! How frickin hard is that?? What are you warning about?? What should I beware of?? I get standing order each week, and used to get extras, but I have plenty to listen to now. I've got a few books to read and may order a few more when I get thru with those, a big $9 investment per book! What are you saving us from? Are you trying to prevent others from getting in at all? or just from avoiding "your hell" - cause what if someone could get in and succeed - is it possible. Or is it all a scam - no one's honest.
Which btw, begs the question: was your upline good or not. 1st you say "I thought my upline were upstanding folks, just like you do."
Then you say "I did not have a "bad upline" or LOS, I had a NORMAL one. If they were so bad, why would we have stayed for 11 years?"
So then whats the deal - if they weren't bad and were normal - why'd you quit??
I know it has nothing to do with me - it has to do with you!
Tony>I know it has nothing to do with me - it has to do with you!
TD>Then why are you taking this so personally? Yes, I have said that you tapespeak, but most of my posts have been very respectful, otherwise. Your posts have degenerated over the last few weeks to nothing but vile diatribes about critics.
What hell did I go through? How would you feel if you worked your A$$ off for 11 years, put your life and dreams on hold (per upline's suggestion) to wake up one day with nothing to show for it? This biz cost me my friendships, good relations with my relatives and nearly (but not, thank God) my marriage. Ours is a long story that I do not have time to post for you. Nor do I see the necessity to. You've already decided that the biz is a good thing. Fine. So my question is: Why are YOU here?
Why am I here? - to see what my prospects are reading! To find out why a guy on Monday says, he wants to sit and and take a look at it, then on Tuesday says, nah, I'm not sure this is for me!
Also for the people coming on here, (that are 99.9% not looking to get on MY team, but are looking at the business) - to let them hear the other side of it. To let them know that not everyone's upline has tried to steal their group, or screw their wife, etc.
I've had good experiences, and I'm just sharing that! When critics say the tools is where all the $$ is made, I showed checks for over $200,000 in just 2 months! When they say the tool $ is hidden I saw, we show it in the Plan EVERY week! When they say the prices are too high, I say, not on the stuff I'm buying and I do 100pv!
And guess what buddy - thats YOUR fault that YOU ruined relationships with friends and relatives! Why is it that I have not?? I see my extended family every weekend! I still have ALL my friends from when I started! Why do me and prospects have to suffer because YOU were overbearing and unbalanced! That is BULLSHIT! I have friends who didn't want to do the business and others that didn't even bother to come to a meeting. Thats is fine! We're still friends, I still go over there house, we still play cards, etc. I have uncles and cousins that know I'm doing something on the side, most were not interested in doing it. We still get together at Grandma's every weekend!
TD, I'm sorry it didn't work out for you, I'm sorry you put other dreams on hold, but didn't you gain Anything from the experience, from the association with the people? What level did you get to? What was it structured like. I sincerely want to know. I know people who after 12 years are only Saphhire, but I also know people who in 3 are Emerald! There's no guarantees. But you can't blame Qx for losing friends. I'm in the same business for almost 2 years now and I haven't lost 1 relationship over it - and never will!
Tony,
I did what I was taught to do by my AQMO. When I was in the business, I thought all my relationships were fine too. I saw my family members a lot. It wasn't till the end and after I got out that I realized what happened. Friends and Family finally felt free to say what they felt, they didn't want to hurt my feelings before.
Tony, you should know me better by now. Do your really think that I was an overbearing jerk to my family members? In fact, that is why I think we were not more successful in the biz, we're too nice! Most of the people I've seen that have been most successful in this are arrogant and forceful. My family relationships were damaged because they saw the truth (some of them had been in before) and we wouldn't listen.
I'm really sick of having this futile debate where you blame the survivors for their pain and loss. I have been pretty polite considering the way you talk to most of us. I think it's time we stopped feeding you.
Basically,
what Tony is saying is that for the 1 or 2 years he has been in that it invalidates anything that has happend to anyone else. Wait till you have been in for 5 to 10 years Tony. Wait till you have a disagreement with your upline. oh wait. "not my upline..he's blah blah blah.."
TD: don't feel like you have to argue with Tony, all his "proof" does not change what happend to you in the business. He can argue technicalities, but he cannot change the truth. The onus is on him to pump up his business, you have nothing to prove to this clown.
Basically his mind is made up, don't confuse him with the facts.
Ok Tony, you are having a good experience for the 2years you have been in so far. Thats good for you, now open your eyes and take a look at all those that haven't. Gee it must be their fault. I guess thats what you have to tell yourself at night to be ok with the prospect of scamming people.
I really have a hard time believing that you do not see the glaringly obvious conflict of interest with the tools. So either you are naive, or incredibly ethically challenged. After seeing your posts I think it's the latter.
When someone says something about what happened in their LOS, which often includes yours Yours does not operate in a vacuum you know.) You claim that it was their fault, because you haven't experienced it. Gosh, I don't know why that would make someone mad. Talk about insult after injury.
Perhaps the reason you haven't seen the corruption is that you haven't been in long enough or seen enough. Maybe it will take you going platinum. Why don't you ask others that have gone platinum or higher in your LOS and other LOS in Britt WorldWide. So is Dorothy's story "bullshit" as well?
Most likely your kind will never understand what is really happening. You'll make it to platinum or higher and make lots of money off the tools and have no problem with it. For that I think there should be a special place in hell for you.
TD, you said that this business cost you your friendships and good relations with your family! So did you or didn't you lose good relations with friends and family?? Were saying you did! Sorry if I had to connect too many dots, but what that means to me is, you were either too adament about them joining and it pushed them away, or that you ignored them if they said no. Was that the case? If it was then its YOUR fault. I have not forced my family to come to meetings, or blown-off any friends or relatives that didn't take a look at this. I still have all the same friends etc.
So maybe then you DIDN'T ruin any relationships, as later you said "When I was in the business, I thought all my relationships were fine too. I saw my family members a lot. It wasn't till... after I got out that... Friends and Family finally felt free to say what they felt, they didn't want to hurt my feelings before."
That doesn't sound like "ruined relationships" TD!! So they didn't agree with the business, you still saw them, still interacted, still had a relationship and still DO! I don't think you are overbearing - but you said you lost friendships & family!! Waht else was I supposed to think. But as it turns out you Didn't lose friendships or family, not from what you're saying now. They simply didn't think the business would work. That doesn't make you bad. That doesn't make the relationship ruined. You really misrepresented that!
And DanD, so I should go to HELL for thinking that buying tools and going to conference is OK. Should Shakira go to hell for making money off CDs - should your college professor go to hell off making money selling you a book, or teaching at seminars. How bout pro football players that put on football camps for aspiring HS players?
The tools are OPTIONAL!! -- and reasonable in price when compared to similar books, CDs, seminars, etc. You are really misinformed about this! You still think the only $ comes from tools! You just keep ignoring the $200,000 in just 2 months from Quixtar checks i sent Qb. You critbots KEEP crying "tool$".
Tony,
I misrepresented nothing. You can have a relationship and still damage that relationship, especially with family. Friends are a different story.
That's it; I'm done with you, Tony. Have a nice life.
Others here have said it better than I, and you have heard it before. The Tools system is a boderline illegal business and definately a conflict of interest. If the tools really were optional, there would not be a standing order. They wouldn't be used to track your business. Everything has been carefully crafted to sound ok on the surface, but can be seen through with a minimal of perception.
If you cannot wrap your head around this concept then I don't know what to tell you. You are truely lost. What really disturbs me is that you have no problem with making money off the tools system. The only reason your upline mentions it in their plan at all is that people know now, thanks to the internet, and he's trying to do spin control.
I think that if you knowingly cheat others that are desperate out of their hard earned money, that there should be a SPECIAL place in hell for you. That is my opinion. There is no conflict of interest with college books. Its been explained to you over and over again, so deal with it.
Fortunately we still have the internet and the free exchange of information.
Maybe you should have a platinum or higher explain to you how it really is, as you are not at a level in the business to see whats really happening.
dan> There is no conflict of interest with college books.
OH! well, I guess you've never heard of profs writing books on a certain subject, and then making it the Required- I repeat Required text for their class!! Care to change your stance! Our tools are optional!! If you don't WANT it - don't F#@ BUY it!!!
Tony
Whatever you have to tell yourself to sleep at night is your business buddy.
I think my experience is not too far off from others here that,
"Tools are optional, but so is success. "
So apparently your upline is a rogue diamond leg in the BWW system.
I will not pretend to have a different experience to placate you. What happened happend.
If you can't figure out the difference between a text book for an acredited college class at university and being leaned on to purchase a motivational tape then God help you. Ok one more time for the hearing impaired. One is a School, the other is BUSINESS. You might want to look up the word.
Thats nice YOU say tools are optional, but last time I checked a 100pv to whatever you are is not in charge of anything in a system.
Tony-Bot said: "When they say the tool $ is hidden I saw, we show it in the Plan EVERY week! "
Does Amway know you are putting this in your plan? The "plan has to be approved by Amway you know.
You're not supposed to use the Profiles of success either (Michael)
Oh, but it's (ha ha) your business. You just don't set prices, inventory, shipping, or PR.
Just do what your upline says and go to the next meeting.
I'm not that far off, and all of you know it.
You have much more control running a hot dog stand. And you'll make more money to boot.
Maybe, if that hot stand is a franchise. Oh, and just for the record - the 1st time I ever heard "tools are optional, and so is success" was on THIS BLOGSITE!! And to date, this is the ONLY place I've heard that. We're told there optional, but I've never heard anyone ever say, and so is success- and that is the honest truth!!
Yea, he's rogue I guess, all the way up to Joe M, and Larry (my EDC and Double). Yea, they're rebels I guess.
Yea, pretty sure Qx knows the plan we show, why do some of you always ask this? I've seen Joe M, Doug and Alan show it themselves in different opens in different cites: $150,000 from Qx at Diamond - $100,000 from BWW, for a total of $250,000 at Diamond. Even though I know Emeralds that make more than that.
So too is politics. Controlling information is impossible.
The Mayor's Office is dealing with a scandal right now in which a member of the administration revealed the identity of one of the fry guys to the Hamburglar, who used that information in a plot that compromised the security of some delicious hamburgers.
Posted by: Mayor McCheese | July 17, 2005 12:55 AM